[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Steve Nickolas]

>From: Pat Villani <Pat.Villani at hp.com>
>Sent: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 09:35:40 -0400
>To: tuhs at tuhs.org
>Subject: [TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

>Folks,

>I recently copied down the 32V source, and compiled the kernel with
>gcc. \x01Much to my surprise, most of it compiled. \x01I then split out the
>machine dependent versus the machine independent files (loose
>classification :-), and compiled again. \x01Naturally, in both cases, you
>could not actually build a kernel because there are vax specific .s
>files, but the individual C files compiled. \x01Not a bad start.
Whew.  Goes to show something about GCC backward compatibility.

>As a result, I've been giving serious consideration to porting it to
>Intel IA32 platforms. \x01It's much simpler than the unix I worked on
>until last year (Tru64, aka OSF/1 and Digital UNIX), and the 32V
>kernel is only a little bigger than the original FreeDOS kernel I
>wrote. \x01The Caldera license is pretty much a BSD license, which could
>be considered an open source license. \x01This means I should be able to
>work on it without worrying about IP, although I'd still need 
>management approval.

It's basically the old (with advertising) BSD license, AFAICT.

>Should I undertake such an project, would there be enough interest to
>justify the effort?

I for one would be interested... :)

>Pat

-uso.

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[David Presotto]

Arnold forwraded this to me:

> Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 09:35:40 -0400
> From: Pat Villani <Pat.Villani at hp.com>
> To: tuhs at tuhs.org
> Subject: [TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...
>
> Folks,
>
> I recently copied down the 32V source, and compiled the kernel with gcc.  Much 
> to my surprise, most of it compiled.  I then split out the machine dependent 
> versus the machine independent files (loose classification :-), and compiled 
> again.  Naturally, in both cases, you could not actually build a kernel because 
> there are vax specific .s files, but the individual C files compiled.  Not a bad 
> start.
>
> As a result, I've been giving serious consideration to porting it to Intel IA32 
> platforms.  It's much simpler than the unix I worked on until last year (Tru64, 
> aka OSF/1 and Digital UNIX), and the 32V kernel is only a little bigger than the 
> original FreeDOS kernel I wrote.  The Caldera license is pretty much a BSD 
> license, which could be considered an open source license.  This means I should 
> be able to work on it without worrying about IP, although I'd still need 
> management approval.
>
> Should I undertake such an project, would there be enough interest to justify 
> the effort?
>
> Pat
>
> -- 
> You can't build a reputation on what you are going to do. -- Henry Ford

He noted the following and asked if I'ld like it posted to this list:

	I see from subsequent mail that a project has been started.

	The members of this list seem to share some common characteristics:

	1. Some spare time for working with code.

	2. A willingness to hack on code.

	3. A desire to work with cleaner, smaller simpler versions of Unix,
	   instead of the modern, er, *full featured* open source systems
 	  (Linux, *BSD).

	I'd like to suggest that perhaps members of this list should check out
	Plan 9 From Bell Labs (http://plan9.bell-labs.com).  The Plan 9 developers
	have recently posted a request for help, for people to tackle some projects
	that need tackling.  Why should people here look at it?

	1. It's from Bell Labs: quality design and concepts guaranteed. (:-)

	2. It's an opportunity to move into the future, instead of hiding out
	   in the past.

	3. Plan 9 deserves good help.

	4. People who appreciate early Unix and current Plan 9 will be welcomed
	   warmly.

	So, check it out,

We sure would like more people using our system and our license is OSI
approved so it least has one stamp as open source.  It clearly is not as
simple 32V or our 10th edition unix.  However, it comes close and is way
simpler than either Linux or the current BSDs.

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Phil Garcia]

> <snip>
> I've been giving serious consideration to porting it to
> Intel IA32 platforms.  It's much simpler than the unix I worked on
> until last year (Tru64, aka OSF/1 and Digital UNIX), and the 32V
> kernel is only a little bigger than the original FreeDOS kernel I
> wrote.  The Caldera license is pretty much a BSD license, which
> could be considered an open source license.  This means I should be
> able to work on it without worrying about IP, although I'd still
> need management approval.  Should I undertake such an project, would
> there be enough interest to justify the effort?

I'd certainly be intrigued enough to run it.

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Pat Villani]

Folks,

I recently copied down the 32V source, and compiled the kernel with gcc.  Much 
to my surprise, most of it compiled.  I then split out the machine dependent 
versus the machine independent files (loose classification :-), and compiled 
again.  Naturally, in both cases, you could not actually build a kernel because 
there are vax specific .s files, but the individual C files compiled.  Not a bad 
start.

As a result, I've been giving serious consideration to porting it to Intel IA32 
platforms.  It's much simpler than the unix I worked on until last year (Tru64, 
aka OSF/1 and Digital UNIX), and the 32V kernel is only a little bigger than the 
original FreeDOS kernel I wrote.  The Caldera license is pretty much a BSD 
license, which could be considered an open source license.  This means I should 
be able to work on it without worrying about IP, although I'd still need 
management approval.

Should I undertake such an project, would there be enough interest to justify 
the effort?

Pat

-- 
You can't build a reputation on what you are going to do. -- Henry Ford

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Wesley Parish]

I tried the same with a few of the utilities and a make with the kernel files.

<shock and awe>Dependencies again</shock and awe> - with most of the utilities 
the compile was easy, since their dependencies were easily filled by the 
standard Linux C libraries.  Since many of the kernel dependencies depend on 
the vax specific .s files and I don't know anything about the vax at the 
moment, I decided to leave it until I _did_ know.  That's why I've been 
asking stoopid questions on this list.

Well, if you're keen on it, I am too.  I need something to do over the 
holidays.

Wesley Parish

On Tue, 21 Oct 2003 02:35, Pat Villani wrote:
> Folks,
>
> I recently copied down the 32V source, and compiled the kernel with gcc. 
> Much to my surprise, most of it compiled.  I then split out the machine
> dependent versus the machine independent files (loose classification :-),
> and compiled again.  Naturally, in both cases, you could not actually build
> a kernel because there are vax specific .s files, but the individual C
> files compiled.  Not a bad start.
>
> As a result, I've been giving serious consideration to porting it to Intel
> IA32 platforms.  It's much simpler than the unix I worked on until last
> year (Tru64, aka OSF/1 and Digital UNIX), and the 32V kernel is only a
> little bigger than the original FreeDOS kernel I wrote.  The Caldera
> license is pretty much a BSD license, which could be considered an open
> source license.  This means I should be able to work on it without worrying
> about IP, although I'd still need management approval.
>
> Should I undertake such an project, would there be enough interest to
> justify the effort?
>
> Pat

-- 
Mau e ki, "He aha te mea nui?"
You ask, "What is the most important thing?"
Maku e ki, "He tangata, he tangata, he tangata."
I reply, "It is people, it is people, it is people."

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Pat Villani]

Wesley Parish wrote:
> I tried the same with a few of the utilities and a make with the kernel files.

Having come to HP from DEC by way of Compaq, vax isn't that challenging 
for me.  :)

I did not try compiling the utilities.  My interests have always been at 
the kernel level.  I am encouraged by the fact that you were able to 
build the utilities.  This should make life a lot easier.

What I've done so far is split the files into vax specific and "somewhat 
vax specific" platform neutral files.  This is just a first cut, where I 
separated out things such as .s files and .c files that are vax 
dependent, such as device drivers, from files that should be platform 
neutral.

I did not go through the platform neutral files to correct for vax 
dependencies, if any.  That's my next task.

I'll tar up what I have so far and put it on a web site for folks to 
look at.

Pat

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Wesley Parish]

I'm doing an en-masse compile of the programs in the /32V/usr/src/cmd 
directory, little-by-little, bit-by-bit.

Some don't compile, some do.

I've also run the bigger utilities - in their separate directories - through 
make with Greg Lehey's little one-liner script from "Porting UNIX Software", 
pg 74:
make 2>&1 | tee -a Make.log 

and will gzip and email them to you if you like.

Wesley Parish

On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 03:00, Pat Villani wrote:
> Wesley Parish wrote:
> > I tried the same with a few of the utilities and a make with the kernel
> > files.
>
> Having come to HP from DEC by way of Compaq, vax isn't that challenging
> for me.  :)
>
> I did not try compiling the utilities.  My interests have always been at
> the kernel level.  I am encouraged by the fact that you were able to
> build the utilities.  This should make life a lot easier.
>
> What I've done so far is split the files into vax specific and "somewhat
> vax specific" platform neutral files.  This is just a first cut, where I
> separated out things such as .s files and .c files that are vax
> dependent, such as device drivers, from files that should be platform
> neutral.
>
> I did not go through the platform neutral files to correct for vax
> dependencies, if any.  That's my next task.
>
> I'll tar up what I have so far and put it on a web site for folks to
> look at.
>
> Pat

-- 
Mau e ki, "He aha te mea nui?"
You ask, "What is the most important thing?"
Maku e ki, "He tangata, he tangata, he tangata."
I reply, "It is people, it is people, it is people."

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Pat Villani]

OK.  I'm in the process of getting approval for this project.  I'll put 
what I've done so far up on a web site and send out the URL.  If you do 
send the gzip'ed commands, I'll include those as well.  No rush, as I 
won't do any of this until this weekend.

Pat

Wesley Parish wrote:
> I'm doing an en-masse compile of the programs in the /32V/usr/src/cmd 
> directory, little-by-little, bit-by-bit.
> 
> Some don't compile, some do.
> 
> I've also run the bigger utilities - in their separate directories - through 
> make with Greg Lehey's little one-liner script from "Porting UNIX Software", 
> pg 74:
> make 2>&1 | tee -a Make.log 
> 
> and will gzip and email them to you if you like.
> 
> Wesley Parish
> 
> On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 03:00, Pat Villani wrote:
> 
>>Wesley Parish wrote:
>>
>>>I tried the same with a few of the utilities and a make with the kernel
>>>files.
>>
>>Having come to HP from DEC by way of Compaq, vax isn't that challenging
>>for me.  :)
>>
>>I did not try compiling the utilities.  My interests have always been at
>>the kernel level.  I am encouraged by the fact that you were able to
>>build the utilities.  This should make life a lot easier.
>>
>>What I've done so far is split the files into vax specific and "somewhat
>>vax specific" platform neutral files.  This is just a first cut, where I
>>separated out things such as .s files and .c files that are vax
>>dependent, such as device drivers, from files that should be platform
>>neutral.
>>
>>I did not go through the platform neutral files to correct for vax
>>dependencies, if any.  That's my next task.
>>
>>I'll tar up what I have so far and put it on a web site for folks to
>>look at.
>>
>>Pat
> 
> 

[TUHS] While on the subject of 32V ...

[Wesley Parish]

Just a short note to say I've compiled the libF77.a library archive.

I'll try the rest of the libraries, and note which ones compile cleanly and 
which throw their hands up in horror.

Wesley Parish

On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 02:41, Pat Villani wrote:
> OK.  I'm in the process of getting approval for this project.  I'll put
> what I've done so far up on a web site and send out the URL.  If you do
> send the gzip'ed commands, I'll include those as well.  No rush, as I
> won't do any of this until this weekend.
>
> Pat
>
> Wesley Parish wrote:
> > I'm doing an en-masse compile of the programs in the /32V/usr/src/cmd
> > directory, little-by-little, bit-by-bit.
> >
> > Some don't compile, some do.
> >
> > I've also run the bigger utilities - in their separate directories -
> > through make with Greg Lehey's little one-liner script from "Porting UNIX
> > Software", pg 74:
> > make 2>&1 | tee -a Make.log
> >
> > and will gzip and email them to you if you like.
> >
> > Wesley Parish
> >
> > On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 03:00, Pat Villani wrote:
> >>Wesley Parish wrote:
> >>>I tried the same with a few of the utilities and a make with the kernel
> >>>files.
> >>
> >>Having come to HP from DEC by way of Compaq, vax isn't that challenging
> >>for me.  :)
> >>
> >>I did not try compiling the utilities.  My interests have always been at
> >>the kernel level.  I am encouraged by the fact that you were able to
> >>build the utilities.  This should make life a lot easier.
> >>
> >>What I've done so far is split the files into vax specific and "somewhat
> >>vax specific" platform neutral files.  This is just a first cut, where I
> >>separated out things such as .s files and .c files that are vax
> >>dependent, such as device drivers, from files that should be platform
> >>neutral.
> >>
> >>I did not go through the platform neutral files to correct for vax
> >>dependencies, if any.  That's my next task.
> >>
> >>I'll tar up what I have so far and put it on a web site for folks to
> >>look at.
> >>
> >>Pat

-- 
Clinesterton Beademung - in all of love.
Mau e ki, "He aha te mea nui?"
You ask, "What is the most important thing?"
Maku e ki, "He tangata, he tangata, he tangata."
I reply, "It is people, it is people, it is people."