From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 9ecb4fbb for ; Sat, 1 Dec 2018 21:35:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 5F27FA1F24; Sun, 2 Dec 2018 07:35:14 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 153ADA1F05; Sun, 2 Dec 2018 07:34:54 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 63B49A1F05; Sun, 2 Dec 2018 07:34:48 +1000 (AEST) Received: from tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net (tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net [45.33.28.24]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0ECE8A1F02 for ; Sun, 2 Dec 2018 07:34:43 +1000 (AEST) Received: from Contact-TNet-Consulting-Abuse-for-assistance by tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Debian-3) with ESMTPSA id wB1LYfiV023967 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Sat, 1 Dec 2018 15:34:42 -0600 ARC-Filter: OpenARC Filter v0.1.0 tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net wB1LYfiV023967 Authentication-Results: tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net; arc=none header.d=tnetconsulting.net ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=tnetconsulting.net; s=2015; t=1543700082; cv=none; b=g/6Q+xu1PhzAc/C7wIu1GkpoclaM3GMFrwA/vmU4CyES3G/I2yLWjd4nxDMojY9s205o+aIrj2X+vfE1+qoJ9OHJocToEvOGyfbfsaLKybZSUCWfgbSvk9sSx4Dp8vhHfEcvgad1nYJNPGtFDfGT3yVJyd9fUedTzm64QK8YRS8= ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; d=tnetconsulting.net; s=2015; t=1543700082; c=relaxed/simple; bh=nd2V1Lr51S99uW8SEXYd409QFnmAJfPoam0qfA85NXY=; h=DKIM-Signature:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:User-Agent: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=JcVxQ0e5Nb0BLkEoIO6rqER19YVboJKIlUzdAcQgn5e0+vtW/VmnVwiQjXuYkVUe8r0AeKlzy6yT4cctxTZJaK6JKz7M1jVzupZD+q/aNflTpZNdA8KPEiD0RrOlxKqcJjq3RUjzpub/PvwrF5HqKSzKhaG5gz3989pmd/M14gA= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net; none DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=tnetconsulting.net; s=2015; t=1543700082; bh=nd2V1Lr51S99uW8SEXYd409QFnmAJfPoam0qfA85NXY=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Message-ID:Date:User-Agent: MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Cc:Content-Disposition: Content-Language:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:Date:From: In-Reply-To:Message-ID:MIME-Version:References:Reply-To: Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Sender:Subject:To: User-Agent; b=7DRmPfhE+WpBlCbg8ztT8ld8CH+FkzsZLiWi6qpcf1CYw6s0pyTaqH1i1skjh6/g+ Xkf9ZtimDTMQrrSeMVQduZx/JEwD6BNHuWfVylASCzW6/X33L2Pu1Ee0NVKgKbDOnD 5LkG9Am96izyFUfOK75EdvF5nILighakSxaPT43A= To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org References: <1543697561.28059.for-standards-violators@oclsc.org> Organization: TNet Consulting Message-ID: <2addfda0-76bf-a649-b2a3-ec6ad1c78418@spamtrap.tnetconsulting.net> Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2018 14:34:43 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <1543697561.28059.for-standards-violators@oclsc.org> Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="------------ms080605030001080505070206" Subject: Re: [TUHS] man-page style X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , From: Grant Taylor via TUHS Reply-To: Grant Taylor Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" This is a cryptographically signed message in MIME format. --------------ms080605030001080505070206 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 12/1/18 1:52 PM, Norman Wilson wrote: > Bill's half right. I didn't invent a language; I used what was there. Can I ask what language you did use? Was it m4 or something else? > I decided that the best way to deal with Sendmail's own configuration=20 > language was to treat it as I would the assembly language for a=20 > specialized, irregularly-designed microprocessor: >=20 > 1. Understand as well as possible what the instructions actually do; > 2. Write the simplest possible program that will get the job done; > 3. Avoid extra layers of macros and so on that hide the details, becau= se=20 > that also hides the irregularities and makes it harder to understand=20 > and debug; > 4. By the same reason, don't just copy someone else's program that doe= s=20 > something complicated; write your own and do things simply. >=20 > Sendmail has plenty of design flaws (not just in the language), as=20 > I'm sure Eric will acknowledge; but I think the biggest problem people = > have had with it that most people copied the rather-complicated sample = > configuration files shipped with the source rather than just reading=20 > the manual, doing a few experiments to understand the behaviour, and=20 > writing something simple. I see the same lack of understanding in a lot of things. > On the other hand, I've never quite understood why so many people=20 > treat device drivers as scary and untouchable, copying an existing one = > and hacking it until it seems to work rather than understanding what=20 > the device actually does and writing a simple program to control it.=20 > So perhaps my brain just doesn't work normally. For me, I don't know where to get good documentation of what the device=20 actually does and how to make it do it. I also don't have a good (read: = any) understanding of the OS / kernels that I'd connect the device to.=20 So, writing software to connect the device (I don't fully comprehend) to = the OS / kernel (that I don't fully comprehend) in a language (that I'm=20 not fluent in) is an uphill battle for me. I have great respect and=20 gratitude for the people that do write device drivers. I don't create the Lego bricks. But I do try to build interesting and=20 useful things out of the Lego bricks that others have built. --=20 Grant. . . . unix || die --------------ms080605030001080505070206 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExDzANBglghkgBZQMEAgEFADCABgkqhkiG9w0BBwEAAKCC Cy4wggVAMIIEKKADAgECAhEA01fiRe1k2R6LEQCcImIMYTANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQsFADCBlzEL MAkGA1UEBhMCR0IxGzAZBgNVBAgTEkdyZWF0ZXIgTWFuY2hlc3RlcjEQMA4GA1UEBxMHU2Fs Zm9yZDEaMBgGA1UEChMRQ09NT0RPIENBIExpbWl0ZWQxPTA7BgNVBAMTNENPTU9ETyBSU0Eg Q2xpZW50IEF1dGhlbnRpY2F0aW9uIGFuZCBTZWN1cmUgRW1haWwgQ0EwHhcNMTgxMTE4MDAw MDAwWhcNMTkxMTE4MjM1OTU5WjArMSkwJwYJKoZIhvcNAQkBFhpndGF5bG9yQHRuZXRjb25z dWx0aW5nLm5ldDCCASIwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEBBQADggEPADCCAQoCggEBANgOhvncDgc4KAlD +pyhFpw6wCfeERlSOAXowjdTjlOR2zcIgzL0TM9A+hkSv2wsVh6fn6VvHGxKrLemReiGd7fQ 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