From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 30055 invoked from network); 20 Jan 2023 00:20:36 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 20 Jan 2023 00:20:36 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8AAF6424F0; Fri, 20 Jan 2023 10:20:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail.kaybuena.com (rrcs-71-42-153-194.sw.biz.rr.com [71.42.153.194]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1E079424EE for ; Fri, 20 Jan 2023 10:20:22 +1000 (AEST) Received: from [192.168.147.6] (4dot2 [71.42.153.195]) by mail.kaybuena.com (8.17.1/8.15.2) with ESMTP id 30K0KKto1684674 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 2023 18:20:20 -0600 Message-ID: <39941541-8461-20c5-8433-978c1cc59454@technologists.com> Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2023 18:20:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.6.1 Content-Language: en-US To: tuhs@tuhs.org References: <202301180943.30I9hrOw030485@freefriends.org> From: "Charles H Sauer (he/him)" In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Greylist: Sender passed SPF test, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.6.4 (mail.kaybuena.com [71.42.153.194]); Thu, 19 Jan 2023 18:20:20 -0600 (CST) Message-ID-Hash: KRQ55366CQUJKXN5CZUPGDTG4ONPRBO5 X-Message-ID-Hash: KRQ55366CQUJKXN5CZUPGDTG4ONPRBO5 X-MailFrom: sauer@technologists.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] owner maintenance (Re: The era of general purpose computing (Re: AIX moved into maintainance mode List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Before Lions, before the Epoch even, there was Muir's Compleat Idiot manual (https://technologists.com/photos/1960s/fullsize/1969JohnMuir.jpg) which suited me well until it didn't. Charlie On 1/19/2023 5:51 PM, segaloco via TUHS wrote: > To be fair I didn't necessarily just have UNIX in mind with that > statement, I also mean whats happening to appliances, vehicles, etc. > It's part of a bigger problem, we're just of course mostly discussing > the implications of that problem vis-a-vis UNIX. Believe me, I also wish > I could peer under the hood of a modern car and tell you how to actually > replace something in there with just a socket and a set of pliers... > > - Matt G. > > ------- Original Message ------- > On Thursday, January 19th, 2023 at 3:44 PM, Rich Salz > wrote: > >> >> In my mind there would probably be a strong correlation between >> engineers making products unnecessarily complicated (whether they >> want to or not) and end users deciding en masse not to sink the >> time into learning how to maintain increasingly convoluted and >> esoteric designs. >> >> >> To me, the biggest surprise about Unix history is that the Bell patent >> office secretaries were able to use ed and [nt]roff. I cannot imagine >> the general populace doing that. >> >> Folks on this list will be fine, there will always be programming >> environments for us. For the rest of the world, simpler is better and >> simpler isn't Unix. > -- voice: +1.512.784.7526 e-mail: sauer@technologists.com fax: +1.512.346.5240 Web: https://technologists.com/sauer/ Facebook/Google/Twitter: CharlesHSauer