From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 21740 invoked from network); 19 Feb 2022 23:20:07 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 19 Feb 2022 23:20:07 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 3F31B944BA; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 09:20:05 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38F0093D52; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 09:18:03 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (1024-bit key; secure) header.d=in-ulm.de header.i=@in-ulm.de header.b="oweDJ3+c"; dkim=pass (1024-bit key; secure) header.d=in-ulm.de header.i=@in-ulm.de header.b="Q34qxeEv"; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (1024-bit key) header.d=in-ulm.de header.i=@in-ulm.de header.b="mypRpUVs"; dkim=neutral (0-bit key) header.d=in-ulm.de header.i=@in-ulm.de header.b="nf22YTQT"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 6BFBB93D52; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 09:18:00 +1000 (AEST) X-Greylist: delayed 351 seconds by postgrey-1.36 at minnie.tuhs.org; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 09:17:54 AEST Received: from pmg.in-ulm.de (pmg.in-ulm.de [217.10.8.27]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F13BC93D51 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 09:17:54 +1000 (AEST) Received: from pmg.in-ulm.de (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by pmg.in-ulm.de (Proxmox) with ESMTP id 08C7820588 for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 00:12:01 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=in-ulm.de; h=cc :content-type:content-type:date:from:from:in-reply-to:message-id :mime-version:references:reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to; s=pmg; bh=nr+1Zsr+23lJtDzmyAkpLv/gB7jp9sXX472UhfiyjqQ=; b=oweDJ 3+cHRkvQa37Y55vouMipUgw62sD1f4N/YV6lGo2fAl3Ip4mPIBCuhxJz6DPdGUbd Wvf8jhWWXCevu6edNA6BTgjfBdvfcP9EGEX4FyEmCcqGL9NN8hY1O/YIdll8vCo/ OtPEYc3N7+XHMRfE+f+F5PHmjGacLuMbDsP/UI= Received: from email.in-ulm.de (unknown [IPv6:2001:1410:200:80e::1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pmg.in-ulm.de (Proxmox) with ESMTPS for ; Sun, 20 Feb 2022 00:12:00 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at in-ulm.de DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=in-ulm.de; s=default; t=1645312320; bh=jaK0wc6oKK0YBFFYd/Bw9lka2HSNtQbqFQFOSlBBAKY=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=Q34qxeEvttV3zXBs/xUtwHOcbw75sHSmerrgkrkB9oN3wJWfwWToLGTTOYAFgiDsX I2usOovtJYSgjSBPGiD37OW4gJ81rnuK+lc+OIyjUji0XwdtPXEZX2d0uSVIQCmHJf ri5C16ZUilpKj7jBA45EMR7kUOj0FzC+ZCCURTSo= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=in-ulm.de; s=default; t=1645312320; bh=8w8/heGKd83hDFlhkz1GCaluOc0xcZ0kH8ErYNrFrjk=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=mypRpUVsL8jm+wVsJ/9QjNg7J0VIBOxUdgdaGutbvjj8MYM2T92TL3eBvLPhrB6E0 6ZrZ0P9+IP65Hz1H+UWH2sCQdb/UwgnALJ7UeEUzBN52sefISTprx++81svElqM+GY e58yN6ZTgkhJHK9yZlTzZwE0r1raUFKIjk/gVv9Y= DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=in-ulm.de; s=default; t=1645312318; bh=8w8/heGKd83hDFlhkz1GCaluOc0xcZ0kH8ErYNrFrjk=; h=Date:Subject:To:References:From:In-Reply-To:From; b=nf22YTQTYR9jXhWAG63tWffdL1fgLo1lrslk8QuH+fp0LSA159ZwPz4iE+myrdmm9 pCiYjKHorowg9dOz/x82m7hCFugEELnyWlGPBNN10x9UO9gGsLWgF02cIovq0MFZg1 0BNUv3LcCRqi5ntTb+r9HVwP7xtTfz0JBHFHyIyY= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------5kD1INzf1pebxTnQFaPnXa7O" Message-ID: <4a8c1f33-ab34-7f5d-321a-a8d759eee7c8@in-ulm.de> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2022 00:11:59 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Language: en-US To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org References: <8102A7AB-21F5-477D-8D37-5412103CD396@iitbombay.org> From: Sven Mascheck In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 source code for sh X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5kD1INzf1pebxTnQFaPnXa7O Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On 19.02.2022 23:39, John Cowan wrote: > On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 1:45 PM Rob Pike wrote: > > I undid all the macros for the v8 shell, with Steve's blessing, > before doing the key work on that shell. But no one outside cared > about any of the research Unixes after v7, > > > Lots of us would have loved to care about them and were sad that we > couldn't until they were open sourced much later. 8th ed sh (about '84) brought quite a few changes and fixes. Just naming a few: - environment variable HISTORY, pointing to a writable file, providing a history mechanism by means of "=(1)" - type is replaced by whatis, which produces output that can be re-evaluated by the shell - functions can be exported, in the same ways like variables keyword history: I always imagined that the Bourne shell would have been in much wider use even nowadays, if only it had provided line editing and a history at some point. Why not? Even Kenneth Almquist released his SVR4-like reimplementation intentionally without history. All that might have been implemented more elegant directly in the terminal I/O instead of in every program? (that is, not in a MS-DOS-like way, where every program even needs its own pager). I still wonder if it would be possible to properly provide line editing and history in the terminal I/O in general. Sven --------------5kD1INzf1pebxTnQFaPnXa7O Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 19.02.2022 23:39, John Cowan wrote:
On Sat, Feb 19, 2022 at 1= :45 PM Rob Pike <ro= bpike@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0
I undid all the macros for the v8 shell, wit= h Steve's blessing, before doing the key work on that shell. But no one outside cared about any of the research Unixes after v7,

Lots o= f us would have loved to care about them and were sad that we couldn't until they were open sourced much later.

8th ed sh (about '84) brought quite a few changes and fixes. Just naming a few:
- environment variable HISTORY, pointing to a writable file, providing a history mechanism by means of "=3D(1)"
- type is replaced by whatis, which produces output that can be re-evaluated by the shell
- functions can be exported, in the same ways like variables

keyword history: I always imagined that the Bourne shell would have been in much wider use even nowadays, if only it had provided line editing and a history at some point. Why not? Even Kenneth Almquist released his SVR4-like reimplementation intentionally without history. All that might have been implemented more elegant directly in the terminal I/O instead of in every program? (that is, not in a MS-DOS-like way, where every program even needs its own pager).

I still wonder if it would be possible to properly provide line editing and history in the terminal I/O in general.

Sven
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