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[72.197.247.231]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y23sm433002pfo.50.2021.02.10.18.30.32 for (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 10 Feb 2021 18:30:32 -0800 (PST) To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org References: <8b580c46-ecfb-9383-ed43-08108b3ee7bf@tllds.com> <20201130163753.GB18187@mcvoy.com> <202102102236.11AMann01820861@darkstar.fourwinds.com> From: Mary Ann Horton Message-ID: <4be538bd-a4ee-4287-4d61-9cc6e18c061b@mhorton.net> Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2021 18:30:31 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------E3C2CF6967A11A540270B88F" Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [TUHS] troff was not so widely usable X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------E3C2CF6967A11A540270B88F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit We had vtroff at Berkeley around 1980, on the big Versatec wet plotter, 4 pages wide. We got really good at cutting up the pages on the output. It used the Hershey font. It was horrible. Mangled somehow, lots of parts of glyphs missing. I called it the "Horse Shit" font. I took it as my mission to clean it up. I wrote "fed" to edit it, dot by dot, on the graphical HP 2648 terminal at Berkeley. I got all the fonts reasonably cleaned up, but it was laborious. I still hated Hershey. It was my dream to get real C/A/T output at the largest 36 point size, and scan it in to create a decent set of Times fonts. I finally got the C/A/T output years later at Bell Labs, but there were no scanners available to me at the time. Then True Type came along and it was moot. I did stumble onto one nice rendition of Times Roman in one point size, from Stanford, I think. I used it to write banner(6). On 2/10/21 5:53 PM, Clem Cole wrote: > Ron. That’s awesome.  Ferrin used the Same set of Hersey Font that the > XGP used.  He got them from Stanford as I recall but they were > publically (aka open source) > > On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 7:28 PM Ron Natalie > wrote: > > We used nroff quite a bit with both the Model37 teletype (for > which it > wsa designed, ours even had the greek box on it) and with output > filters > for the lineprinter and the Diablos. > > Later on we drove troff into cat emulators that used Versatec > printers. >     I don’t knwo wher Berkely’s vcat got their fonts, but the JHU > verset > had an amusing history on that. > > George Toth went down to the NRL which had a real CAT and printed out > the fonts in large point size on film.    In the basement of the > biophysics bulding was a scanning transmission electron microscope > which > used a PDP-11/20 as its controller and an older (512x512 or so) > framebuffer.    George took the scanning wires off the microsope nad > hooked them up to the X and Y of a tektronics oscilliscope.   Then he > put a photomutlipler tube in a scope camera housing and hoked the > sense > wire from the microscope to that. > > He now had the worlds most expensive flying spot scanner.  He’d tape > one letter at a time to the scope and then bring up the microscope > sofware (DOS/BATCH I think) and tell it to run the microscope.    > Then > without powering down the memory in the framebuffer, he’d boot up > miniunix and copy the stuff from the framebuffer to an RX05 pack. > After months of laboriously scanning he was able to write the CAT > emulator. > > I had gone to work for Martin Marietta wirking on a classified > project > so I wrote hacks to the -mm macro package to handle security markings > (automatically putting the highest on each page on thte top and > bottom). >     Later when ditroff became available I continued to use it with > various laserprinters.    I even wrote macropackages to emulate IBM’s > doc style when we were contracting with them. > > This was all to the chagrin of my boss who wanted us to switch to > Framemaker. > > > > -- > Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual --------------E3C2CF6967A11A540270B88F Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

We had vtroff at Berkeley around 1980, on the big Versatec wet plotter, 4 pages wide. We got really good at cutting up the pages on the output.

It used the Hershey font. It was horrible. Mangled somehow, lots of parts of glyphs missing. I called it the "Horse Shit" font.

I took it as my mission to clean it up. I wrote "fed" to edit it, dot by dot, on the graphical HP 2648 terminal at Berkeley. I got all the fonts reasonably cleaned up, but it was laborious.

I still hated Hershey. It was my dream to get real C/A/T output at the largest 36 point size, and scan it in to create a decent set of Times fonts. I finally got the C/A/T output years later at Bell Labs, but there were no scanners available to me at the time. Then True Type came along and it was moot.

I did stumble onto one nice rendition of Times Roman in one point size, from Stanford, I think. I used it to write banner(6).

On 2/10/21 5:53 PM, Clem Cole wrote:
Ron. That’s awesome.  Ferrin used the Same set of Hersey Font that the XGP used.  He got them from Stanford as I recall but they were publically (aka open source) 

On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 7:28 PM Ron Natalie <ron@ronnatalie.com> wrote:
We used nroff quite a bit with both the Model37 teletype (for which it
wsa designed, ours even had the greek box on it) and with output filters
for the lineprinter and the Diablos.

Later on we drove troff into cat emulators that used Versatec printers. 
    I don’t knwo wher Berkely’s vcat got their fonts, but the JHU verset
had an amusing history on that.

George Toth went down to the NRL which had a real CAT and printed out
the fonts in large point size on film.    In the basement of the
biophysics bulding was a scanning transmission electron microscope which
used a PDP-11/20 as its controller and an older (512x512 or so)
framebuffer.    George took the scanning wires off the microsope nad
hooked them up to the X and Y of a tektronics oscilliscope.    Then he
put a photomutlipler tube in a scope camera housing and hoked the sense
wire from the microscope to that.

He now had the worlds most expensive flying spot scanner.   He’d tape
one letter at a time to the scope and then bring up the microscope
sofware (DOS/BATCH I think) and tell it to run the microscope.    Then
without powering down the memory in the framebuffer, he’d boot up
miniunix and copy the stuff from the framebuffer to an RX05 pack.
After months of laboriously scanning he was able to write the CAT
emulator.

I had gone to work for Martin Marietta wirking on a classified project
so I wrote hacks to the -mm macro package to handle security markings
(automatically putting the highest on each page on thte top and bottom).
    Later when ditroff became available I continued to use it with
various laserprinters.    I even wrote macropackages to emulate IBM’s
doc style when we were contracting with them.

This was all to the chagrin of my boss who wanted us to switch to
Framemaker.



--
Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual
--------------E3C2CF6967A11A540270B88F--