From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,NICE_REPLY_A,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 24464 invoked from network); 28 Jan 2021 05:26:30 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 28 Jan 2021 05:26:30 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id E62279C0A6; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:26:27 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 421E79B72B; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:25:54 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (1024-bit key; secure) header.d=tnetconsulting.net header.i=@tnetconsulting.net header.b="UL/Xazpc"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 50EA89B720; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:25:51 +1000 (AEST) Received: from tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net (tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net [45.33.28.24]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9B3E99B715 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2021 15:25:50 +1000 (AEST) Received: from Contact-TNet-Consulting-Abuse-for-assistance by tncsrv06.tnetconsulting.net (8.15.2/8.15.2/Debian-3) with ESMTPSA id 10S5Pn3A024594 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128 verify=NO) for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2021 23:25:50 -0600 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=tnetconsulting.net; s=2019; t=1611811550; bh=oLr9R3JzRwyyGX6MYX27PAokJIjNmV1uSEoo2J+ayyc=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Message-ID:Date:User-Agent: MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Cc:Content-Disposition: Content-Language:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:Date:From: In-Reply-To:Message-ID:MIME-Version:References:Reply-To: Resent-Date:Resent-From:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Sender:Subject:To: User-Agent; b=UL/XazpcADy/8TtayEohqQj3wUiQN6xQcIWEI6jLPonE4iFDpAdE51gJSFeYqqRCC 1RP10gs7fztAEHC+cGHHLlorAcTPzls+lS+z2u6BRl6Dpr6JF8Ok0DTm/C2+wzjbfO 3m6+1N0gYs5bmO77SrMR4nx56fH3QgeakVav9Wyg= To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org References: <862d8a34-456d-33c1-7ef0-58c6e8089de9@tnetconsulting.net> <202007211822.06LIMBJ4018831@freefriends.org> <20200722011603.GA1536749@mit.edu> <64f487fb-6fed-e741-4e7b-daed1f646e37@spamtrap.tnetconsulting.net> Organization: TNet Consulting Message-ID: <6c5ee770-99e0-acaf-18d1-d392a0ccaa84@spamtrap.tnetconsulting.net> Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2021 22:24:07 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha-256; boundary="------------ms060401030203030204060908" Subject: Re: [TUHS] /bin vs /sbin X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , From: Grant Taylor via TUHS Reply-To: Grant Taylor Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" This is a cryptographically signed message in MIME format. --------------ms060401030203030204060908 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 1/27/21 3:35 PM, Greg A. Woods wrote: > Thanks! (but I still need to pester my service provider for rDNS!) You're welcome. > Sorry, I should have been a tiny bit more specific: the "user=20 > interface" here refers to a Graphical UI. Unix of course didn't start = > out with a GUI of any kind, and workstation vendors like Sun and many=20 > others at the time made a big deal out of how they were offering a=20 > better user interface for their systems. Hum ... > I separate "kernel" and "userland" (here meaning all the command-line=20 > programs, etc.) only because that's become a more common way to define = > the "base OS" in unixy, i.e. linuxy, circles. When I think of Base OS, I think of AIX, because it's the first place I=20 saw Base OS, referred to as BOS, explicitly called out. But, I know=20 that Solaris and HP-UX also have a very minimal install. Even Linux has = very minimal installs (debootstrap, Slackware boot+root, and DSL come to = mind). I think of development applications / compilers, fancy text processing,=20 networking, X11, office applications as all being add on products.=20 Sure, Linux tends to come with a LOT of them installed by default. I guess the base OS to me is what's required to boot, maintain, and=20 install a system. Anything else is ancillary as far as -- what I=20 consider to be -- the base OS is concerned. > This distinction between the traditional Unix layer and the GUI is=20 > quite important in the history of SunOS, since there have been a number= =20 > of different offerings from Sun for their GUI (Sun Windowing System,=20 > SunView, NeWS, SunWindows); and also in how Sun promoted their various = > GUI offerings as the solutions for wider use. Hum. I guess my exposure to Solaris installations has tainted my view.=20 I helped support some DB servers with the full GUI developers=20 workstation installed, just in case it was needed. The people that=20 installed them didn't want to ever go back and pull something else in.=20 Which is why we had to patch Firefox, Thunderbird, and Pidgen /=20 libpurple on Solaris database servers. At least until I ripped those=20 things, along with the kitchen sink, out. It made patching so much=20 faster and smaller. > Even with the advent of a common choice of The X Window System as the=20 > basis for most workstation vendor's GUIs, there were still battles=20 > over which toolkit and window manager and "look and feel" would prevail= =20 > (Athena vs. Motif vs. OpenLook), with Sun even evolving their offerings= =20 > (SunWindows, OpenLook) over time. I'm vaguely aware of CDE and that there were others before / around=20 that. But my personal experience is largely after that. As such, I=20 wasn't aware of some of the things that you are talking about. Thank=20 you for enlightening me. --=20 Grant. . . . unix || die --------------ms060401030203030204060908 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Description: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExDzANBglghkgBZQMEAgEFADCABgkqhkiG9w0BBwEAAKCC CzkwggUhMIIECaADAgECAhA/wgXwQl9mDHSg5enGHBeSMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBCwUAMIGWMQsw CQYDVQQGEwJHQjEbMBkGA1UECBMSR3JlYXRlciBNYW5jaGVzdGVyMRAwDgYDVQQHEwdTYWxm b3JkMRgwFgYDVQQKEw9TZWN0aWdvIExpbWl0ZWQxPjA8BgNVBAMTNVNlY3RpZ28gUlNBIENs aWVudCBBdXRoZW50aWNhdGlvbiBhbmQgU2VjdXJlIEVtYWlsIENBMB4XDTIwMTExNjAwMDAw MFoXDTIxMTExNjIzNTk1OVowKzEpMCcGCSqGSIb3DQEJARYaZ3RheWxvckB0bmV0Y29uc3Vs dGluZy5uZXQwggEiMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBAQUAA4IBDwAwggEKAoIBAQDM6cGNMlSUFPM3zVw+ VgSslz2QRtMj+FerQ0DpmgbhUzqm5hMRe0hMA2OBf41HDAeOV0RKcLx2+HozHlyQST2xagOX xiv91aEXezh8bEBfnOI564Ej/JfusomfoM7ByVXcLp3K3fOssHos6IXiAD6WT+jcRs7Cg+Gl 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