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[107.215.223.229]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x13sm7932001qkp.102.2021.11.28.18.23.03 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 28 Nov 2021 18:23:04 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3693.20.0.1.32\)) From: Bakul Shah In-Reply-To: <20211129011244.GJ18441@mcvoy.com> Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2021 18:23:02 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <702642B0-311F-4464-B0EB-44166731EAFC@iitbombay.org> References: <202111282026.1ASKQ5X41437843@darkstar.fourwinds.com> <202111282115.1ASLFK1Q1438854@darkstar.fourwinds.com> <202111282147.1ASLlND41439656@darkstar.fourwinds.com> <20211129011244.GJ18441@mcvoy.com> To: Larry McVoy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3693.20.0.1.32) Subject: Re: [TUHS] A New History of Modern Computing - my thoughts X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list , Eugene Miya Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" On Nov 28, 2021, at 5:12 PM, Larry McVoy wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 28, 2021 at 07:19:08PM -0500, Clem Cole wrote: > >> 64 bit PDP-11 > > That would be pretty cool. Your comments about minimalist approaches ring > really true for me. The last conversation I had with Greg Chesson was > a 2 hour rant from him about the fact that nobody who is doing anything > these days understands the value of a minimalist approach, it's one > complex framework or whatever after another. Indeed. As far as processor design is concerned, I believe one of the problems is that there are fewer and fewer people who can do both h/w and s/w design competently. This is why I think more programmers should roll up their sleeves and design a processor and understand the issues involved, especially now that programming FPGAs is becoming common. May be start with an existing RISC-V core in some HDL, and push and pull it into (what you think is) an ideal minimalist design. Even adding a codegen target for such a processor (to at least tcc or Ken's C compiler) won't be all that hard. I believe this sort of co-design is what is needed to move past the current designs. It will likely be some young whippersnapper who doesn't know what is impossible, rather than one of us greybeards!