From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 88c7c152 for ; Mon, 20 Jan 2020 18:22:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 75BA19C13B; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 04:22:14 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CFE69C0FD; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 04:21:18 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="key not found in DNS" (0-bit key; unprotected) header.d=smtpservice.net header.i=@smtpservice.net header.b="lEBQMOiR"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 5986F9C0FD; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 04:21:16 +1000 (AEST) X-Greylist: delayed 668 seconds by postgrey-1.36 at minnie.tuhs.org; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 04:21:12 AEST Received: from a1i626.smtp2go.com (a1i626.smtp2go.com [43.228.186.114]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 321079BFE6 for ; Tue, 21 Jan 2020 04:21:12 +1000 (AEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=smtpservice.net; s=m33y30.a1-4.dyn; x=1579545372; h=Feedback-ID: X-Smtpcorp-Track:To:Message-Id:Reply-To:Date:From:Subject:Sender: List-Unsubscribe; bh=3ZIE2FLprQlVqPixh5p5L2sHzE9cOqb0YP5Hc843/B8=; b=lEBQMOiR o0MrmutebUBJUNA3kTJej1eZ53amCsWtRU7tEDMh/Irs+oFhM0HhrylQyxV3q/0f+pO0KS4hPERgN vlmvAKaygdgQfxRoiic4xNkbTn5UFQ06jVl+eZW7hUsgJfQaryLo7SzLBpUcg1A0wUOsvL20a8bJ0 BPNb9bQmeLSjyzMQ70FMgoWnQXlQmL0iMj9D5ktzfOLu7ccx26jTgO7tYBss6gCJJPm8LKSyoCBS0 RPwOYok16hNP2RxpusHTt+WpGeI5eUQE553KxPEhaSdkjyGNdXuPY0pGg+IaNUH/3HKu6r6hP17nL 9gJ5rHNiyKIIuhIooaMPmP5pNA==; Received: from [10.173.255.233] (helo=SmtpCorp) by smtpcorp.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92-S2G) (envelope-from ) id 1itbUu-NaPURW-Os; Mon, 20 Jan 2020 18:10:00 +0000 Received: from [10.107.193.50] (helo=kdbarto.org) by smtpcorp.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.3:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92-S2G) (envelope-from ) id 1itbUt-IbZx6g-L1; Mon, 20 Jan 2020 18:09:59 +0000 Received: from zaphod.local (zaphod.local [IPv6:fe80::1451:8c97:467a:eff8]) by kdbarto.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5FCC514DFCD5; Mon, 20 Jan 2020 10:09:54 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.0 \(3608.40.2.2.4\)) From: David Barto In-Reply-To: <20200120180432.GJ28686@mcvoy.com> Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2020 10:09:55 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <7C45A7D2-1FE9-46F0-AA31-396671704214@kdbarto.org> References: <20200117195908.GF15253@ancienthardware.org> <20200118035051.GC481935@mit.edu> <20200118041913.GB67053@eureka.lemis.com> <20200119024900.GA15860@mit.edu> <20200119031225.GI67053@eureka.lemis.com> <20200119035808.GK67053@eureka.lemis.com> <20200119132551.GC15860@mit.edu> <20200120180432.GJ28686@mcvoy.com> To: Larry McVoy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.40.2.2.4) X-Smtpcorp-Track: 1itPltmPZx6gL1.Jdz0o-5Qv Feedback-ID: 145083m:145083a-yaNWS:145083senxjjGXvA X-Report-Abuse: Please forward a copy of this message, including all headers, to Subject: Re: [TUHS] Early Linux and BSD (was: On the origins of Linux - "an academic question") X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Reply-To: david@kdbarto.org Cc: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" On Jan 20, 2020, at 10:04 AM, Larry McVoy wrote: >=20 > On Mon, Jan 20, 2020 at 12:19:25PM -0500, Clem Cole wrote: >> On Sun, Jan 19, 2020 at 10:52 PM George Michaelson = wrote: >>=20 >>> It does me no credit, that I initially reacted very badly to 386BSD, >>> and the initial {Net,Free,Open} situation. >>>=20 >> First, be careful. What we sometimes call 386BSD as a 'release' = started >> just as a port of NET2 to the 386 based 'commodity' hardware = platform. The >> history is that in the late 1970s/early 80s Bill Jolitz was working = for Nat >> Semi and ported BSD 4.1, to a multibus based NS16032 board that NS = had >> built, which was similar to the Stanford University Network (SUN) = terminal >> what had a 68000. He eventually built a 'luggable' using that and = updated >> to the port to 4.2++. He (and Lynn I believe) started a company to = sell >> that hardware/software solution and for whatever reason, it did not = really >> take off. >=20 > I know those Nat Semi chips very well, or did at the time. I so = wanted to > love those chips, the instruction set felt like whoever did the PDP-11 > did the 320xx chips. But they couldn't produce chips without bugs and > that killed them. It's a crying shame, I liked the instruction set > WAY better than the VAX. The VAX seemed really messing compared to=20 > the PDP-11, the 320xx chips seemed clean. Might be rose colored=20 > glasses but that's my memory. My memory as well. A friend and I got ahold of the complete set of chips and started to build out the hardware for a Unix box. We got most of the way there too, and then the odd quirks started showing up. We tracked some of them to our layout and the others to the NS chips. Then we gave it up as a =E2=80=9Cah, it would have been nice if only=E2=80=9D = project. David