From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 4c491b87 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2020 17:19:22 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 4499E9BCFD; Wed, 12 Feb 2020 03:19:21 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1B529BCE3; Wed, 12 Feb 2020 03:19:03 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=pass (1024-bit key; unprotected) header.d=kilonet.net header.i=@kilonet.net header.b="aCtjYXXu"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id C77A39BCE3; Wed, 12 Feb 2020 03:19:02 +1000 (AEST) Received: from p3plsmtpa06-08.prod.phx3.secureserver.net (p3plsmtpa06-08.prod.phx3.secureserver.net [173.201.192.109]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1985F9BCDE for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2020 03:19:02 +1000 (AEST) Received: from medusa.kilonet.net ([72.69.214.144]) by :SMTPAUTH: with ESMTPA id 1ZBcjTiAcoPuC1ZBdj8FAY; Tue, 11 Feb 2020 10:19:01 -0700 Received: from [199.89.231.101] (ender.kilonet.net [199.89.231.101]) by medusa.kilonet.net (8.14.8/8.15.1) with ESMTP id 01BHJ0BK021432 for ; Tue, 11 Feb 2020 12:19:00 -0500 (EST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=kilonet.net; s=default; t=1581441540; bh=fYksGn08vftmPIoLP6iwKa0tZWZy4umVlBHCXH7swNk=; h=Subject:To:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=aCtjYXXubq2T0yyqysMw9GkhcWAAx44Tczshyfto5hJ51ZxJCyS9aYJ2AYgba3/vD oJh0duGTFqFlIpuOJlbwingU00MPBRvfpj0+M+CkkZDDtq8N9kexjlMOhWKog3eW5X 5d8ep4LeydfHs7DdRMOhSoa0Kq5UDGxxmH6Jdtk4= To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org References: <202002101546.01AFkOSc001266@freefriends.org> <202002110933.01B9XqQX004159@freefriends.org> <20200211170501.0N1Pu%steffen@sdaoden.eu> From: Arthur Krewat Message-ID: <9c056bdf-0813-8df6-20b9-03b5fa1686d9@kilonet.net> Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2020 12:18:55 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.4.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20200211170501.0N1Pu%steffen@sdaoden.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfIc9pPLy1DB1VVoKXGlLq7GaSUs52MXnKVgAehhVJQMDziCxURRYkfiM610p6wiu1PddhJLn2Cvs9I/alqZ1lonMLqnJf+MMLmfyudnMk+a/uReWnV4K /N9UzeEyFRlIB8lDNPJpVtxaEZ9siKvPZfd2Sws7rmDl/gn8ZBVtp5W6T6OBbTUaPNlRvQCMCwzfTw== Subject: Re: [TUHS] V9 shell [was Re: Warner's Early Unix Presentation] X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" Sorry to top-post... To me, the biggest handicap to getting anything done, code-wise, command-line-wise, basically anything, is the keyboard/mouse. I use keyboard shortcuts as much as possible, being an old LA36 kind guy, but I would love to have something that just by looking at text, be able to highlight, copy/cut/paste, etc. Even action buttons. It would be great to look at the "Send" button in Thunderbird and press a key on the mouse or keyboard (or some other eye-contact type signal) and "do" it. Was anything ever done in terms of sub-vocalization? Lots of stories in Sci-Fi about that, nothing ever came out of it, I don't think. On 2/11/2020 12:05 PM, Steffen Nurpmeso wrote: > Rob Pike wrote in > : > |My general mood about the current standard way of nerd working is how \ > |unimaginative and old-fashioned it feels. There are countless ways \ > |we could be interacting with our terminals, editors, and shells > |while we program, but for various sociological and historical reasons \ > |we're pretty much using one from decades ago. I'm sure it's productive \ > |for almost everyone, but it seems dull to me. We could be > |doing something much more dynamic. I mean, xterm is hardly more sophisti\ > |cated than the lame terminal code that ran in mpx (ca. 1982), other \ > |than colors and cursor addressing, which date from the 1960s > |via early PCs. IDEs don't sing to me, although they are powerful, because \ > |they don't integrate well with the environment, only with the language. \ > |And they are just lots of features, not a coherent > |vision. No model to speak of. > | > |Compare what happened with our shell windows with what happened with \ > |our "smart" phones in the last 20 years and you'll get some inkling \ > |of what I think we're missing. It's not that we should program the > |way we use iPhones, but that there are fields where user interface \ > |work has made a real different recently. Not so in programming, though. \ > |We're missing out. > > I cannot imagine any other real step forward but control-by- > thought, aka brain computer interfaces. (I personally am even > convinced we will get the brain implant -- ever since i got all > those B and C Hollywood movies from the 50s wrong, back when i was > a kid. It is convincing still, automatic emergency calls, health > record and cases of incompatibility at hand when needed, and not > to talk about the hints it will give the law enforcement side of > the road.) > > Just last year i have seen a report on the current stage of > affairs, Carnegie-Mellon and Minnesota Universities seem to have > build a non-invasively controlled robotic arm, pretty high > precision. > > "Wir haben erhebliche Fortschritte im Bereich > Robotervorrichtungen mit Gedankensteuerung über Gehirnimplantate > gemacht. > We have made substantial progress in the region of > thought-controlled robotic devices via implants. > > Das ist hervorragende Forschungsarbeit", sagt He. > "That is superb research work", says He [Professor Bin He, > Carnegie-Mellon]. > > "Nichtinvasiv ist jedoch unser ultimatives Ziel. > Fortschritte in der neuronalen Dekodierung und der praktischen > Auswirkungen auf die mögliche Entwicklung nichtinvasiver > Nutzbarkeit nichtinvasiver Roboterarmsteuerung werden erhebliche > Neurorobotik haben." > > "Albeit non-invasive is our ultimate goal. > Progress in neuronal decoding, and the practical usability of > non-invasive control of robotic arms will have substantial > effect on the possible development of non-invasive > neuro-robotics." > > |But I'm a grumpy old man and getting far off topic. Warren should cry, \ > |"enough!". > > I personally would love it, if it where only in the hands of > empathic beings, capable of reflection. Yet it is us. ^_^ > > --steffen > | > |Der Kragenbaer, The moon bear, > |der holt sich munter he cheerfully and one by one > |einen nach dem anderen runter wa.ks himself off > |(By Robert Gernhardt) > >