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Sent from my iPhone On Jan 12, 2019, at 10:16, Eric Allman wrote: >> Eric, please fill me in. > > I have to admit that my memories are a bit fuzzy, but I'll try to fill > in what I can. > >> On 2019-01-12 9:20 AM, Clem Cole wrote: >> ... >> FWIW: Since I had been working networking at both CMU and Tek before I >> came to UCB, one of the first things I did when I arrived in fall '81 >> was to install the Gurwitz BBN IP/TCP stack on 4.1 so we could run >> Ethernet between the 3 CAD machines in Cory Hall to replace the use of >> BerkNet over 9600 baud serial links (IIRC Eric Cooper, was involved with >> that hack also). When I had arrived, few machines at UCB were on LANS >> and the need for ARPAnet style networking >>besides<< email was still >> limited. The way people connected to systems was their terminal was to >> connect over serial links and we had a giant 'plugboard' that allowed >> you patch your terminal into one of the systems [I wonder if there are >> pictures of these somewhere in the UCB archives - it was quite something]. > > That it was. When the INGRES group got our ARPAnet connection (VDH to > LBL, as you mentioned) it was the only long-haul connection to campus > that I know of. Eric Schmidt had done BerkNET, but that was local mail > and file copy only, and BerkNET mail didn't connect to ARPAnet mail, so > there were "plugboard wars" over who got one of the two RS232 > connections we had available for outside users (this was out of a grand > total of 16 connections on a DH-11, each at about $1000/port, iirc). I > was nominally responsible for the ARPAnet connection, so I had senior > faculty on my case about how they all "needed" dedicated connections to > their office (but of course they didn't want to pay for them). This was > the original inspiration for delivermail, which later became sendmail. > >> We had three 780s in the CAD group in Cory and really did not like the >> plugboard scheme. From my previous experience, I wanted something like >> telnet or supdup, like we had been messing with at CMU and Tek. Hence >> my push to put the BBN code on the CAD systems and use an ethernet. >> Eric, please fill me in. You must have been running the BBN code then >> also, since Ing70 and then IngVax were the ArpaNet connection (via >> a VHDH to the LBL IMP - UCB did not yet have its own IMP). But I know >> the CAD systems 4.1 networking stuff was done by me. > > As I recall IngVax never had any ARPAnet service, and Ing70 was running > the NCP code from San Diego, which could well have originated at BB&N, > but I can't confirm that from memory. Conversely, Ing70 was never on > any "modern" networking technology such as 3Mbit ethernet (I don't think > there were even NICs at that time). > >> Its a little fuzzy now, but memory is that Bob Kriddle had run a Xerox 3 >> Meg cable in Cory, from my machine room over to the Ingres machine room >> also; but I've forgotten the details. BerkNet (i.e. serial links) >> allowed email to flow on campus, but I'm thinking we were trying to make >> that both more efficient and allow telnet/ftp [which might not have >> happened until after the C/30 IMP was installed in Evan later). [Since >> all ARPAnet email followed through IngVax, Eric's history of dealing >> with the header file format of the month in the old delivermail program >> would force his writing sendmail - said history has been repeated here >> and elsewhere previously]. > > Yes, modulo it being Ing70, not IngVax. > >> But this thread got me thinking a little bit. I've forgotten actual >> LAN topology we had a UCB now. I know from the CAD hosts, we could talk >> to the other hosts in our lab in Cory for sure, I want to say we could >> talk to a few other hosts in Evans and Cory; as I know Sam would give me >> code usually via some type of network connection, although sneaker-net >> with 9-track tapes used a great deal too. I want to say the connection >> was over Kriddle's 3M Xerox cable (Eric do you remember what you had in >> IngVax in those days). I know we also a had real 10Meg cable in floor >> our lab in Cory, plus at least one Xerox board on one of the systems, >> another had a DEC interface in it, and Interlan boards in at least two >> others another. We must have even had a 3Com board in the third >> system; as I remember hacking both the Interlan and 3Com drivers (I had >> written a 3Com driver at Tek previous for VMS. The Interlan board was >> new, as was the DEC board; but I've forgotten what we got when). The >> original CAD 780 ('Coke') must have had multiple interfaces in it, but >> I really don't remember. > > You would think I would remember more of the network situation around > the INGRES project given that we had someone working on distributed > databases (Ken Birman, now at Cornell I think, did something called > COCANET). However, I have no recollection at all about what the > connection actually was. It might be possible to pull some of Ken's old > papers (late 70s/early 80s) and get more information there. > > eric