From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 18035 invoked from network); 28 Jun 2022 21:32:46 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 28 Jun 2022 21:32:46 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3210040C54; Wed, 29 Jun 2022 07:32:11 +1000 (AEST) Received: from wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout4-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.20]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3520740C34 for ; Wed, 29 Jun 2022 07:32:06 +1000 (AEST) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1967B32004AE; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 17:32:05 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mailfrontend1 ([10.202.2.162]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 28 Jun 2022 17:32:05 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=serissa.com; h= cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding:content-type:date:date:from:from :in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to; s=fm1; t=1656451924; x= 1656538324; bh=c986PKWX1Knt40D6aB43Bm5XVM1hjGVdGjRR5gDdL2c=; b=N eNeeN+ceTtZ5wnuUlCUx7jaoke7soCwT3BNmda9XDnYx9ZGjOcaCVCuZnIcy6sbX DAW6S6pVPVubsdgekTyy2XZmio8NM5WnfL7DOOUemj0iwG2SXMj5mvjl3AfdxBvl zOB6t/iuU1zHmw6nYDZuP8hUUqwMioFkISRBjkhUHZurVkXNO+Ry1gro7SqcW5LI 4JUYraeBcOhK/lLiQ46cRtGKIkL05g8NXjJNhyZDUAT4r6C/184ptiqnsiSsj4Zc jW4Wjggzk/mDgyjE5k3EVq0jWK8VGhCC7br5HFjZ7bLvUHuDYBXtOQZQKu7O6OEO SeR+FVGbNT0OuvDqh+55g== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:cc:content-transfer-encoding :content-type:date:date:feedback-id:feedback-id:from:from :in-reply-to:in-reply-to:message-id:mime-version:references :reply-to:sender:subject:subject:to:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy :x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; t=1656451924; x= 1656538324; bh=c986PKWX1Knt40D6aB43Bm5XVM1hjGVdGjRR5gDdL2c=; b=X ui56vDM+o9uM/RQYi01QTLWsExWNBiy271/Gv7EIDrZo58xPCBERClMIOxDF8xB0 Fdi2fayQ9Rq9kFUy6MEsLBv0dhFIL7N4kIaL4hWbXkL5Fmc4bRNAwKZNl/5AMTlr uCRbIPUiqm+EK1feAdd8A+LAvppBU+a4KvlCCp948MK78yCPqp8c7v7Hjl/gvfCn ErAEPPe6hDsde0L1RAaU6irAahUp5osqUAwpBXFt0manFCLWXonztVgfuzNBOjJB DHSEg4DGSYdjk/JtMtPhGZ7wl+oPgMFbmxs6/YrN2Alyos5KfcLFApgj/HWJgY4U jjpq587G5P6JQvohRP2kg== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Received: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvfedrudegjedgudeifecutefuodetggdotefrod ftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfgh necuuegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurheptggguffhjgffvefgkfhfvffose htqhhmtdhhtdejnecuhfhrohhmpefnrgifrhgvnhgtvgcuufhtvgifrghrthcuoehsthgv figrrhhtsehsvghrihhsshgrrdgtohhmqeenucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeelvedtffelud ekgfevuddtleeihfetgeffteevgfejheekfeehiedugfdvffeigfenucevlhhushhtvghr ufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehsthgvfigrrhhtsehsvghrih hsshgrrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Feedback-ID: ibf61458d:Fastmail Received: by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 17:32:04 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 16.0 \(3696.100.31\)) From: Lawrence Stewart In-Reply-To: <20220628155050.2D27618C096@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2022 17:32:03 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20220628155050.2D27618C096@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> To: Noel Chiappa X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3696.100.31) Message-ID-Hash: BUOPKS7A3BDJ7PVBSVYXCHVJUGUSTLUJ X-Message-ID-Hash: BUOPKS7A3BDJ7PVBSVYXCHVJUGUSTLUJ X-MailFrom: stewart@serissa.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Research Datakit notes List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: I=E2=80=99ll argue there is quite a lot known about where to put network = functionality, much of it from HPC. If you want minimum latency and minimum variance of = latency, both of which are important to big applications, you make the network = reliable and move functionality into the host adapters and the switches. The code path at = each end of a very good MPI implementation will be under 200 machine = instructions, all in user mode. There is no time to do retry or variable code paths. Doesn=E2=80=99t work on WANs of course, or at consumer price points. (I think there is still a lot to do, because the best networks still = hover around=20 800 nanoseconds calling SEND to returning from RECV, and I think it = could be 100). -L > On 2022, Jun 28, at 11:50 AM, Noel Chiappa = wrote: >=20 >> From: Rob Pike >=20 >> having the switch do some of the call validation and even maybe >> authentication (I'm not sure...) sounds like it takes load off the = host. >=20 > I don't have enough information to express a judgement in this = particular > case, but I can say a few things about how one would go about = analyzing > questions of 'where should I put function [X]; in the host, or in the > 'network' (which almost inevitably means 'in the switches')'. >=20