From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FROM,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 24839 invoked from network); 10 Mar 2023 17:54:34 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 10 Mar 2023 17:54:34 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23F5241581; Sat, 11 Mar 2023 03:54:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-pj1-x102e.google.com (mail-pj1-x102e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::102e]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EFB264141C for ; Sat, 11 Mar 2023 03:54:22 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-pj1-x102e.google.com with SMTP id p3-20020a17090ad30300b0023a1cd5065fso5945065pju.0 for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2023 09:54:22 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; t=1678470862; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:references:in-reply-to :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=q6TW4mOVvAdx4f4xCZU2mBaO5/qq6g9Tr7JzJZu+yqE=; b=D7Zie7y6KNosd0bxQjrsEZpQjgOwZO7/ImiSsW79uTn7tNUkz36mAWg85yrGqCIoO/ 8KAr/1OBYkWdT9/KMVtQ0IS6T9miLtD0iLff2uY/3MjO6Q8AW9wqS5WvrUMyv7SkpHJ5 41Iojz+6pRRRPPhakasTlSUMCqJVUHe40wKCTX53ES3ZhtjPi/X/osA3L8NYzPDfocFV nBv5iMABdxSee0dV4nhpsM+1ugkOCF/XmeSqIZKwC93OnJh/E/ihJSNHLgvK4TimRFFF BKktaa/6ZABPELlDV1Hfl9g54ByaYQeKCyV6bBj+c4NYb9CH99mJZscU/G7OHo4Yjaz7 /e3w== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; t=1678470862; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:references:in-reply-to :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=q6TW4mOVvAdx4f4xCZU2mBaO5/qq6g9Tr7JzJZu+yqE=; b=5181C68bbbSMgraTB8Drb1ViE4oB5KvFfXERr1p4cAEXO6jRtodsyE+9YbwGWvWrTT Z7nnPyFEx2zFAt6rSkH97uKEehUrcUCBoLsCsSgQg8zW1jRnZDMbxOj2OkQvpSesG6ec Ffde3+Q2jXvy/hDesp9WcTuwUElFXMxWok/sp2/X+nsXO3oCv9MD0wPw6QS+a1GeX9DQ o5K9X+z15+VS+4KCvTMZDDtegHB1Lg5Hsn7GQ2nmaf7HLTX7KjRWP1IfhyhwgxOHKXmM g/wTGLxdM4AwXSukX3UrX0IBzT2cC048gZqTja1V6XASnOxF7hW4rW13N1mYs5mGqJqm MwGw== X-Gm-Message-State: AO0yUKXTl4GO58Cr4Q3zdiA30H81Xy4M3nMSKdhv2ua+E30z1XUF3V9W HFrSxdRiQ5gUMA5ttCgyPyPklOOEzwDrIRXLaVgoxGck X-Google-Smtp-Source: AK7set/pRRyplyT3IrXe0ytK3ZpO7x2QjO+rtoBsgtgDHCNxO0uHPrUlw6ghhjbxxJsf2i+bXBby+yA2jrZ7AqlrPOc= X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:485:b0:19a:f22b:31d4 with SMTP id jj5-20020a170903048500b0019af22b31d4mr10176067plb.7.1678470862488; Fri, 10 Mar 2023 09:54:22 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 2002:a05:6a10:c184:b0:448:d92c:1b8f with HTTP; Fri, 10 Mar 2023 09:54:21 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20230310115145.7F23118C080@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> From: Paul Winalski Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2023 12:54:21 -0500 Message-ID: To: Clem Cole Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-ID-Hash: QHDABCAR7PR663OFXSPXBTTUZK2RTRCS X-Message-ID-Hash: QHDABCAR7PR663OFXSPXBTTUZK2RTRCS X-MailFrom: paul.winalski@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: Noel Chiappa , tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: I can't drive 55: "GOTO considered harmful" 55th anniversary List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On 3/10/23, Clem Cole wrote: > > Arnold's observation about trying to be small is reasonable, > although contemporaries like BLISS did have support. So the comparison > should really be to BCPL, PL/360, BLISS, *et al*. for features/size > [although Wulf cheated, the BLISS-11 compiler was not self-hosting and > needed a PDP-10 to run it]. For what it's worth, BLISS does not have a GOTO expression (BLISS doesn't have statements per se--everything is an expression and can be used as a value). Wulf was studying code optimization. His BLISS-11 compiler, and its successor at DEC, BLISS-16, implemented many advanced (for the day) optimizations. In the programming environments at CMU and DEC it was easier to suffer the mild inconvenience of cross-compilation than to try to shoehorn the compiler into a 16-bit address space. It certainly would be possible to implement a native BLISS compiler for the PDP-11, but you'd have to sacrifice either some of the optimizations or take a big hit in compilation speed. -Paul W.