From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 From: clemc@ccc.com (Clem Cole) Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2017 11:20:02 -0500 Subject: [TUHS] lost ports In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: ​I also left out.... E.) GEM tools ran on VMS, Ultrix, Mica, OSF/1, Tru64, Mac OSx, NT/4 and later Windows version up too and now Win10​ And I was just reminded that there was a 68K back-end done for it also that terminal folks used, although I'm not sure I ever saw it. Ron - for whatever its worth, the whole BLISS vs C is different history both outside and inside of DEC [which some of lived and I'll not repeat it here]. But it is sadly miss represented. I'm a C programmer and while I learned BLISS before C, I certainly prefer C to BLISS as do many of my peers - even heavy, heavy BLISS hackers I know. You should know that the compiler team was definitely BLISS based, as was the VMS group, but once Streams I/O was added to VMS and the C compiler introduced, most VMS customers left RMS I/O; while continuing to use FORTRAN as the primary VMS end-user language, BLISS was less so, C and Pascal quickly became more popular. Even at DEC, C took off, particularly in the HW teams if for no other reason than you could hire C programmers from Universities and you had to teach them BLISS. Clem On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 11:01 AM, Clem Cole wrote: > ​below...​ > > On Wed, Jan 4, 2017 at 4:24 PM, ron minnich wrote: > >> but another true story: I visited DEC in 2000 or so, as LANL was about to >> spend about $120M on an Alpha system. The question came up about the SRM >> firmware for Alpha. As it was described to me, it was written in BLISS and >> the only machine left that could build it was an 11/750, "somewhere in the >> basement, man, we haven't turned that thing on in years". I suspect there's >> a lot of these containing oxide oersteds of interest. > > > ​Cute story but not true [and I was @ DEC working Alpha at that time]. > Some facts: > > A.) The SRM firmware was in C primary and Assembler and used >>UNIX<< > tools not VMS tools for development > B.) The GEM compiler (which still exists and still being developed by > VMSI) had front ends for at least (which I remember): BLISS, C, PL/1, > Pascal, ADA, FORTRAN​, Cobol, RPG and a few others (I'll try to ask if I > see any of the old GEM guys in the Cafe' in the next few hours - they are > dying off BTW - but that's a different story). > C.) The GEM compiler has backends for, Vax, Galaxy, MIPS, Alpha, x86 > (32bit), ia64, INTEL*64 (post DEC/Compaq/HP) and I believe also ARM (I'll > need to ask if the VMSI folks come to lunch on Friday). > D.) Alpha's ran UNIX before they ran VMS BTW. The HW debug was all UNIX. > > Clem > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: