From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 29723 invoked from network); 15 May 2023 12:20:31 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (2600:3c01:e000:146::1) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 15 May 2023 12:20:31 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD000414B2; Mon, 15 May 2023 22:20:24 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-vk1-xa31.google.com (mail-vk1-xa31.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a31]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 15916414B1 for ; Mon, 15 May 2023 22:20:08 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-vk1-xa31.google.com with SMTP id 71dfb90a1353d-44fd3c2300dso4518853e0c.1 for ; Mon, 15 May 2023 05:20:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; t=1684153206; x=1686745206; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=gBze1V5PShhCEPBtF3dFNh44dOWemjPHg9KhiOxA8lE=; b=AoyIaNf6QLEdioMEhLHBIiHeBrK55b/QeWB89Xv8Qn5Bv07OrmXvt3YX4hMdzk+ef3 i41TdVXvQscXh3LHDNt6VWxojKQMPGzrliM1VBtpFtYxyUk5erCCZOkcruCBXssjLXrq qF0f+Eg2YUPhoQRuf7oXDYUWou5yVEe8bKJk0= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20221208; t=1684153206; x=1686745206; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=gBze1V5PShhCEPBtF3dFNh44dOWemjPHg9KhiOxA8lE=; b=a9Qt841lWsRy3zRNSfqjXjUrAt2nse6sUiAiS16soLDwKuBxTBdyWyJuXuRHMDIwkO yUvVyBC+AKlg7qdULvWRxUWC0Jli+k+v1unAXy/bP5AY51DrDhbcQBp8LPmqF4k/Yglt 50qJ9PHrkkajE7P0EIGfIbH1Bjl+3jfCH66c8wHrFUGQr6ZWT9v+Ne1rp8IwJ1O2KXO1 VGRBCGzJA7jxeMLBhcjUYQnpdwaCAQxnNrNBRIjw2KQb6PjmbB5Wi35OHQc/VXvXg4DI SOgTYRK5UCXbC/HFSr++cDT5zA9gATj8OC1S+bRV/ZoYFXadKVE1qMhAYruVWx5XiRSG vf4w== X-Gm-Message-State: AC+VfDwbN9pyNmJc8VT2uAT29Uwsa1uZM+sorIULGJqKttfCzkgtIykG fEz7hXpU495e1VAVwUchhYfHcl+wuCAEXX1ZctrvIw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ACHHUZ5V/o3BOLFKuQ/R3w4Z0qh00Q6bt0WAQCeYeyVAVE/QWNnpd+4iZ6yPreuXgq/aLiTsk3p53s+S9jep83L3TJs= X-Received: by 2002:a1f:bd0d:0:b0:44f:d3ba:76c2 with SMTP id n13-20020a1fbd0d000000b0044fd3ba76c2mr10091400vkf.8.1684153206362; Mon, 15 May 2023 05:20:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Clem Cole Date: Mon, 15 May 2023 08:19:55 -0400 Message-ID: To: segaloco Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009ce89e05fbba791e" Message-ID-Hash: 2NJL74IZRTKZOKIZBGE3WBQYHHL2NDVF X-Message-ID-Hash: 2NJL74IZRTKZOKIZBGE3WBQYHHL2NDVF X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: A Census of /etc and /sys Prior to V4 List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --0000000000009ce89e05fbba791e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Matt, This is wonderful work. Thank you. Clem On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 12:28 AM segaloco via TUHS wrote: > I've just completed the Fourth Edition pass of commits in my manual > history repository here: https://gitlab.com/segaloco/mandiff > > Something I've kept a particular eye on is what the landscape looked like > on the filesystems over the early years of development. Here are some of > those observations with a few areas perhaps requiring further illumination: > > In the first two editions, there was a file, /etc/uids, which mapped > simply a username to a uid. The reason was presumably due to the plaintext > passwords in /etc/passwd at the time. The arrival of crypt(III) and > related functionality rendered this moot by the time of V3. Additional > GECOS information is first spotted in /etc/ident in V2 but by V3 has also > found home in /etc/passwd in the GECOS field today used often for a user's > full name. The s1-bits source codes refer to /etc/passwd where > disassembled s2-bits binaries refer to /etc/uids still, dating both sets of > code. > > References to /etc/motd first appear in the V2 manual from what I could > find, so that may not have been around in V1. Additionally, after V1 many > files are moved from /etc to locations under /usr such as ascii and kbd > moving to /usr/pub and roff's suftab moving to /usr/lib. It seems in the > First Edition, manual section VII mapped to /etc itself it seems, with etc > and misc in the manual being synonymous. > > So all in all it seems, in terms of support files anyhow, /etc wound up > smaller by the advent of the C system, at which point init beings using > /etc/rc and the directory begins to expand again. > > Another directory of interest is /sys for a few reasons. First, this > directory serves different purposes depending on your kernel these days, > with BSD systems storing system source code here whereas Linux provides a > kernel interface filesystem. I'm not sure what other contemporary systems > may use this for, but from V3 and back, this was another RK disk mounted in > addition to /usr. This /sys directory appeared to contain the manuals, > source code to system components including the commands, kernel, > bootloader, and languages, and a copy of the kernel image referenced down > in the source tree. > > In total I've identified the following directories: c, fort, lang, man, > mdec, source, sys. Most names should be obvious from later releases, with > lang being a parent directory that contained bdir and mdir B and m6 > languages respectively. My guess is that when RP support was made workable > in V4, there was no longer a need to segregate data amongst RKs like this > so /sys was merged into /usr, leading to the later structure we see in > V4-V6. Of note, this structure is implied in CB-UNIX still in the path > names of the source code available on the archive. The kernel is found at > /tsys/sys/ much like the kernel in V1-V3 living at /sys/sys. > > One thing I haven't been able to glean in the process is precisely how the > command and library source code was stored in these very early versions. > The kernel in T.R. Bashkow's analysis is implied to be stored in files > u[0-9x].s, and command source files at least exist somewhere as the command > followed by .s. As of V5, the command, syscall wrapper, and library source > codes are split up amongst a number of directories with names such as s1, > s2, s3, etc. under source. By V7, this has taken on the cmd/lib/sys > structure of later releases. > > Finally, just a general curiosity the version study involved has raised. > Given the movement of UNIX to the 11/45 and then to C, does the Third > Edition represent a version of UNIX for the 11/45 with protection but > written in assembly, not C? I've seen one handwritten document that makes > mention of some of this, but is there any other information such as > documents, code, etc. concerning the 11/45 assembly version? Was work > completed on the 11/45 kernel changes in the context of this version and > then simply "ported" to the C version or were there concepts that were > cropping up in one or the other and varying amounts of transportation back > and forth as 11/45 and C aspects were implemented? > > As always, thanks for keeping up, hopefully I can get this repository up > to V6 soon, then the real branching fun begins. The V3 to V4 changes are > hopefully the last time the commit diffs have major noise, what with the > conversion from roff to nroff. I suspect transitions to macro packages > later won't be as bad. > > - Matt G. > -- Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual --0000000000009ce89e05fbba791e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Matt,

= This is wonderful work.=C2=A0 Thank you.=C2=A0

<= /div>
Clem

On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 12:28 AM segaloco v= ia TUHS <tuhs@tuhs.org> wrote:
I've just completed the Fourth E= dition pass of commits in my manual history repository here: http= s://gitlab.com/segaloco/mandiff

Something I've kept a particular eye on is what the landscape looked li= ke on the filesystems over the early years of development.=C2=A0 Here are s= ome of those observations with a few areas perhaps requiring further illumi= nation:

In the first two editions, there was a file, /etc/uids, which mapped simply= a username to a uid.=C2=A0 The reason was presumably due to the plaintext = passwords in /etc/passwd at the time.=C2=A0 The arrival of crypt(III) and r= elated functionality rendered this moot by the time of V3.=C2=A0 Additional= GECOS information is first spotted in /etc/ident in V2 but by V3 has also = found home in /etc/passwd in the GECOS field today used often for a user= 9;s full name.=C2=A0 The s1-bits source codes refer to /etc/passwd where di= sassembled s2-bits binaries refer to /etc/uids still, dating both sets of c= ode.

References to /etc/motd first appear in the V2 manual from what I could fin= d, so that may not have been around in V1.=C2=A0 Additionally, after V1 man= y files are moved from /etc to locations under /usr such as ascii and kbd m= oving to /usr/pub and roff's suftab moving to /usr/lib.=C2=A0 It seems = in the First Edition, manual section VII mapped to /etc itself it seems, wi= th etc and misc in the manual being synonymous.

So all in all it seems, in terms of support files anyhow, /etc wound up sma= ller by the advent of the C system, at which point init beings using /etc/r= c and the directory begins to expand again.

Another directory of interest is /sys for a few reasons.=C2=A0 First, this = directory serves different purposes depending on your kernel these days, wi= th BSD systems storing system source code here whereas Linux provides a ker= nel interface filesystem.=C2=A0 I'm not sure what other contemporary sy= stems may use this for, but from V3 and back, this was another RK disk moun= ted in addition to /usr.=C2=A0 This /sys directory appeared to contain the = manuals, source code to system components including the commands, kernel, b= ootloader, and languages, and a copy of the kernel image referenced down in= the source tree.

In total I've identified the following directories: c, fort, lang, man,= mdec, source, sys.=C2=A0 Most names should be obvious from later releases,= with lang being a parent directory that contained bdir and mdir B and m6 l= anguages respectively.=C2=A0 My guess is that when RP support was made work= able in V4, there was no longer a need to segregate data amongst RKs like t= his so /sys was merged into /usr, leading to the later structure we see in = V4-V6.=C2=A0 Of note, this structure is implied in CB-UNIX still in the pat= h names of the source code available on the archive.=C2=A0 The kernel is fo= und at /tsys/sys/ much like the kernel in V1-V3 living at /sys/sys.

One thing I haven't been able to glean in the process is precisely how = the command and library source code was stored in these very early versions= .=C2=A0 The kernel in T.R. Bashkow's analysis is implied to be stored i= n files u[0-9x].s, and command source files at least exist somewhere as the= command followed by .s.=C2=A0 As of V5, the command, syscall wrapper, and = library source codes are split up amongst a number of directories with name= s such as s1, s2, s3, etc. under source.=C2=A0 By V7, this has taken on the= cmd/lib/sys structure of later releases.

Finally, just a general curiosity the version study involved has raised.=C2= =A0 Given the movement of UNIX to the 11/45 and then to C, does the Third E= dition represent a version of UNIX for the 11/45 with protection but writte= n in assembly, not C?=C2=A0 I've seen one handwritten document that mak= es mention of some of this, but is there any other information such as docu= ments, code, etc. concerning the 11/45 assembly version?=C2=A0 Was work com= pleted on the 11/45 kernel changes in the context of this version and then = simply "ported" to the C version or were there concepts that were= cropping up in one or the other and varying amounts of transportation back= and forth as 11/45 and C aspects were implemented?

As always, thanks for keeping up, hopefully I can get this repository up to= V6 soon, then the real branching fun begins.=C2=A0 The V3 to V4 changes ar= e hopefully the last time the commit diffs have major noise, what with the = conversion from roff to nroff.=C2=A0 I suspect transitions to macro package= s later won't be as bad.

- Matt G.
-- <= br>
Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual
--0000000000009ce89e05fbba791e--