From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 16006 invoked from network); 6 Jul 2022 19:15:37 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 6 Jul 2022 19:15:37 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC62E40713; Thu, 7 Jul 2022 05:15:26 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-wr1-f48.google.com (mail-wr1-f48.google.com [209.85.221.48]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EAC3B406F7 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2022 05:15:18 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-wr1-f48.google.com with SMTP id v14so23374797wra.5 for ; Wed, 06 Jul 2022 12:15:18 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=KrOv6R7bw6TWiW6I18n8K91Oh069GwmU+RvYf3Uoibk=; b=ipMuz3UQ8SeDhFPtfiQaho2dV8mV7xkZSEiiUjSOortohXc5lsFBVUQwVDjvLezHAB f/LNDgLt7Z0fdXj+rjYWFYDYVibWZr/XQwuwLzh/M9OmIXzR2hEchukN5WoATqqdRIZs sorUAm3jMn073UDDEJSf6FaFAIHDdwGrfr/xw= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=KrOv6R7bw6TWiW6I18n8K91Oh069GwmU+RvYf3Uoibk=; b=TNxYiEJKvCBOuMjdLrnwAgCqHZyvv9Bt/QqbiSWoRZEHRITDMjGwyz4zP5q0V0g3NF /3FfmypEzFqvfw87VxpsIhXCeoH8FPYGsrJ6ZGJSMM9YLWKuOtgojKRFcdCVSMtQvHqx MKkSJNpmSNgHPuZQ9NbpxK1kyJfgT/vDnF3lxYBmEbKzqG94580lOhz9BjinONb1NdWx b7MOGGregDqEjS5Fsb4jW5vCbidVX2i5dOHxf8dDCPGRyKEgK48/yyRSJ9nooSxwzEvw y7Wr8/RueCf65ILNt6tKJLUjcURb8TNQOhqdXsDYI64xMnBt/ioYEd5Ji3NFghBIr88G jZFQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora8OOJOvCq1B2EsRrEqwN+r52X2H9EdPpa+gPbzPxLTGnA7k45pk trFJYxlu9VDOeI5bLEbV1Bjbe50vUQp8DQW7fu6NEmQfnlE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1urKQmHmHUSbzKw9h4URxOfA9W+1RB7aK6rRlTO7rLNrmYeXAnXanO5hSUjbvg/PmxE/4eEEoGbJo1a5XnDDhs= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:6e8d:0:b0:21d:7223:1e1b with SMTP id k13-20020a5d6e8d000000b0021d72231e1bmr10371639wrz.713.1657134857144; Wed, 06 Jul 2022 12:14:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202207061816.266IGVAA002244@freefriends.org> In-Reply-To: <202207061816.266IGVAA002244@freefriends.org> From: Clem Cole Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2022 15:13:49 -0400 Message-ID: To: arnold@skeeve.com Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000081656605e327c69b" Message-ID-Hash: MURLQ4WUNGY6NVU6J24624OZ5YH3WYM5 X-Message-ID-Hash: MURLQ4WUNGY6NVU6J24624OZ5YH3WYM5 X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: tuhs@tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Stuart Feldman's EFL List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --00000000000081656605e327c69b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Arnold -- good memory. It was in 4BSD (see disk1 of the McKusick disks) but it is not in 3BSD. I agree with you, it was not in V7 or 32v (but was in later BSD 2.9/10/11 releases). Frankly, I have memories of Ratfor in V7 on the PDP-11 [and used as part of my thesis on the Vax]. IIRC to use ratfor on the 11, you needed the V7addenda that had a bunch of F77 fixes. I have memories of EFL and reading the doc. But I have no memories of ever using it - although Hilfinger may have talked about it in the UCB grad comparative languages seminar maybe in 81/82 timeframe (my memory is hazy - I know it was there that Paul was the one that taught me to not hate Ada so much and understand why Ada was like it was). What I can not place is where I first saw EFL. My WAG would be UCB. FWIW: Stu did a sabbatical at UCB when I was a grad student. I'm going to guess maybe he brought it with him during that time. On Wed, Jul 6, 2022 at 2:16 PM wrote: > Hi. > > EFL was definitely a part of BSD Unix. But I don't see it in the V7 > stuff in the TUHS archives. When did it first appear? Was it part > of 32V and I should look there? > > It is definitely in the V8 and V10 stuff. > > Did anyone actually use it? I have the feeling that ratfor had already > caught on and spread far, and that it met people's needs, and so > EFL didn't really catch on that much, even though it provided more > features on top of Fortran. > > Thanks, > > Arnold > --00000000000081656605e327c69b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Arnold -- good memory.

It was in 4= BSD (see disk1 of the McKusick disks) but it is not in 3BSD.=C2=A0 I agree = with you, it was not in V7=C2=A0 or 32v (but was in later BSD 2.9/10/11 rel= eases). Frankly, I have memories of Ratfor in V7 on the PDP-11 [and used as= part of my thesis on the Vax].=C2=A0 =C2=A0IIRC to use ratfor on the 11, y= ou needed the V7addenda=C2=A0that had a bunch of F77 fixes.

I have memories of EFL and reading the doc.=C2=A0 But I have no memor= ies of ever using it - although Hilfinger may have talked about it in the U= CB grad=C2=A0comparative languages seminar maybe in 81/82 timeframe (my mem= ory is hazy - I know it was there that Paul was the one that taught me to n= ot hate=C2=A0Ada so much and understand why Ada was like it was).=C2=A0 Wha= t I can not place is where I first saw EFL.=C2=A0 My WAG would be UCB.

FWIW:=C2=A0 =C2=A0Stu did a sabbatical=C2=A0at UCB when I = was a grad student.=C2=A0 =C2=A0I'm going to guess maybe=C2=A0he brough= t it with him during that time.

<= div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Wed, Jul 6, 2022 at 2:16 PM <arnold@skeeve.com&g= t; wrote:
Hi.
EFL was definitely a part of BSD Unix.=C2=A0 But I don't see it in the = V7
stuff in the TUHS archives.=C2=A0 When did it first appear?=C2=A0 Was it pa= rt
of 32V and I should look there?

It is definitely in the V8 and V10 stuff.

Did anyone actually use it?=C2=A0 I have the feeling that ratfor had alread= y
caught on and spread far, and that it met people's needs, and so
EFL didn't really catch on that much, even though it provided more
features on top of Fortran.

Thanks,

Arnold
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