From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_MESSAGE, MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [50.116.15.146]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF98727241 for ; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 17:00:30 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FEC743E13; Fri, 28 Jun 2024 01:00:24 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-vk1-xa2e.google.com (mail-vk1-xa2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::a2e]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 09DD543E12 for ; Fri, 28 Jun 2024 01:00:18 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-vk1-xa2e.google.com with SMTP id 71dfb90a1353d-4ef748596d7so1553108e0c.0 for ; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 08:00:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; t=1719500417; x=1720105217; darn=tuhs.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=fzpZDlo8V3nFcvDqWwsIY43qcnDikvLa2EDt0HzvL2w=; b=TqnT1E2vVo2CHZ1vqIFpR4QlO4c5G9GcPz2IXfxLg8f08aKcHStRQb7IAKHVsYAQcl dmwFkZNbgdsGJuFPUUNtk0bvTwDlCQJkU1f/V9WBHij1MOoMh0jSI7FNZjCfqp38oEfQ RXglTKXDdUGnsyDL22ctEAr+fbPLNxlmS3GPw= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1719500417; x=1720105217; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=fzpZDlo8V3nFcvDqWwsIY43qcnDikvLa2EDt0HzvL2w=; b=dtno2o3quHMCGmsoKJNEyvLahZ0abUOq+eiVRafyoso5ZHg3pFUliOs+EolclfvbuZ 6h3ba9Y5DjFRVBYWj3Fd4ih9TU0DRxZDMYw/6pXT+v6aPyp4SFDZHEYLLdDBU+YP7yJS P5m8I4j2RIxE2pJrfwcBQdr5XYRuaBXUBBkCOI2qsAO3wamJXK04SpexnJtOLOuQljxn zcoNx02iaaL6CbLAipcQVA6sMvYZAPSAzIkx4n2aUe6Zv/Buaa3H5wGOOFfGJZIhBcaa ewz72OGvBBR4jQ1lvjTwaFBjhGH0X725E9JC+T14phEFWAc2934Ol5H78+PRgYPlT4hj dmyg== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXJe6MWs7F4D6tPJqIOPYJspm4JKw0owhZI2CegMhprmtxbaBBQHtkh2qRbJT0oEuB3G5oIv1IM/1o3+FmG X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0Yx7KnlfAxbsnW3M/YX7xGU8K0IyXieHULkxsddULan9xi1JgAH3 CtwiJkVhqotVfI1Zc0zvra21kH5cxSwO41J+FaI/YKfg8UpzXY/6j1QXXo1eP/JUKYQRbRfhFAi OR5EFJEVDSG5OoqpzL+ilpEwKaSzjoDhucSLi X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IGyacCTabqi/5vVmcCIR2TPyx+icNqkiRK86uI6BE1TqwNE8kNmU5fnZhSUXWCpWViDrcwRWDSzwRLrg5un+5s= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6122:134e:b0:4ec:efaf:a020 with SMTP id 71dfb90a1353d-4ef6d8b10d4mr12797240e0c.15.1719500416735; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 08:00:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20240626215309.XWtuefzk@steffen%sdaoden.eu> <1174fd8f-573e-4508-b193-82dcfe05266a@case.edu> In-Reply-To: From: Clem Cole Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2024 10:59:40 -0400 Message-ID: To: Andy Kosela Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000087f818061be0633e" Message-ID-Hash: XKDZ6CLUOTJRA53R4HJKMHA4F3JSLSJ2 X-Message-ID-Hash: XKDZ6CLUOTJRA53R4HJKMHA4F3JSLSJ2 X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: Alan Coopersmith , Marc Rochkind , "tuhs@tuhs.org" X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: ANSI (C) vs IEEE (POSIX) Standards Body Selection List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --00000000000087f818061be0633e Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Boy, I hate people rewriting history. As someone who lived it, it is just not the case. I do not doubt that rms will try to take credit, but I think a few of us there should send notes to Open Group. FYI: Jim Issak was a marketing guy from Charles River Data Systems, which is abbreviated C-R-D-S, and the firm always spelled out the letters. But the rest of us pronounced it CRuDS=E2=80=94adding an "u" and pronouncing it= =E2=80=94which I was referred to in my first email. When the P1003 committee was established, Jim was aware of the naming issue, particularly after the CRDS experience. There was a great argument in one of the early meetings about whether it should just be a "*Portable Operating System*" as opposed to a "*Portable Operating System Interface*." The concern was that we were starting with the System Call API or interface [which we had inherited from /usr/group) but planned from the beginning (even in /usr/group days) to be more than the system call API. As I said, we started with the System API as that would be hard enough to find common ground -- remember DEC, in particular, was pushing for VMS-like stuff (case folding in file names). As you can see, we agree to use an add interface. Hal's comment about it being called IEEEIX is strange. I do not remember it ever being called that, and as an editor, I can say that I have no memories of using that term. Could someone at IEEE in NYC try to call it the same? I did not hear it or remember any document that used it, so I do not know what he is talking about. It was not something I generated, and to have done that would have taken edits. I wonder if Open Group has the full SCCS files. I kept it in SCCS originally and generated some of the documentation Jim needed for IEEE with SCCS commands. =E1=90=A7 =E1=90=A7 =E1=90=A7 On Thu, Jun 27, 2024 at 10:29=E2=80=AFAM Andy Kosela wrote: > > > On Thursday, June 27, 2024, Chet Ramey via TUHS wrote: > >> On 6/26/24 8:44 PM, Clem Cole wrote: >> >>> rms had nothing to do with the name posix. I have no idea where that >>> comment came from. >>> >> >> http://www.opengroup.org/austin/papers/posix_faq.html >> >> >> > Richard confirms it on his own website, too. > > https://www.stallman.org/articles/posix.html > > --Andy > --00000000000087f818061be0633e Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Boy, I hate people rewriting history. As someone who li= ved it, it is just not the case. I do not doubt that rms will try to take c= redit, but I think a few of us there should send=C2=A0notes to Open Group.= =C2=A0=C2=A0


FYI: Jim Issak was a marketi= ng guy from Charles River Data Systems, which is abbreviated C-R-D-S, and t= he firm always spelled out the letters. But the rest of us pronounced it CR= uDS=E2=80=94adding an "u" and pronouncing it=E2=80=94which I was = referred to=C2=A0in my first email.

When the P1003 com= mittee was established, Jim was aware of the naming issue, particularly aft= er the CRDS experience.=C2=A0 There was a great argument in one of the earl= y meetings about whether it should just be a "Portable Operating Sy= stem" as opposed to a "Portable Operating System Interface= ."=C2=A0 Th= e concern was that we were starting with the System Call API or interface [= which we had inherited from /usr/group) but planned from the beginning (eve= n in /usr/group days) to be more than the system call API. As I said, we st= arted with the System API as that would be hard enough to find common groun= d -- remember DEC, in particular, was pushing for VMS-like stuff (case fold= ing in file names).=C2=A0 As you can see, we agree to use an add interface.=

=

=
Hal's comment about it being called IEEEIX=C2=A0is stra= nge. I do not remember it ever being called that, and as an editor, I can s= ay that I have no memories of using that term. Could someone at IEEE in NYC= try to call it the same? I did not hear it or remember any document that u= sed it, so I do not know what he is talking about. It was not something I g= enerated, and to have done that would have taken=C2=A0edits.

I wonder if Open Group has the full SCCS files.=C2=A0 I kept it in S= CCS originally and generated some of the documentation Jim needed for IEEE = with SCCS commands.
3D""=E1=90=A7
3D""=E1=90=A7
3D"==E1=90=A7

On Thu, Jun 27, 2024 at 10:29=E2=80=AFAM Andy Kos= ela <akosela= @andykosela.com> wrote:


On Thursday, June 27, 2024, Chet Ramey via TUHS <= tuhs@tuhs.org> wr= ote:
On 6/26/24 8:44 P= M, Clem Cole wrote:
rms had nothing to do with the name posix.=C2=A0 I have no idea where that = comment came from.

http://www.opengroup.org/austin/papers/posix_faq.html



Richard confirms it on his own website, to= o.


--Andy
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