From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_IMAGE_ONLY_28,HTML_MESSAGE, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 2545 invoked from network); 1 Jul 2022 15:03:30 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 1 Jul 2022 15:03:30 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD57E40C87; Sat, 2 Jul 2022 01:03:23 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-wm1-f48.google.com (mail-wm1-f48.google.com [209.85.128.48]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 15EA240C65 for ; Sat, 2 Jul 2022 01:03:19 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-wm1-f48.google.com with SMTP id n185so1470180wmn.4 for ; Fri, 01 Jul 2022 08:03:19 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=e3A2ct2ZXl6fqBqS94QH8Db3etI29vYEjYeXM/XpnAA=; b=hC3+I7LLSoBIzyKsXTIJjtYs1OihY5ZDvZPWdl+Ss6NgKR0/KsWmfZsZW4LEREH1/4 CN1vH1GStuaGZIgRl8axOurnoLg3+ln5QeuoMbK74xsTeXO65yZS/VXURY2Pm2f7Lwnz I9HOqBouVTfwI/Ker9dhb/En4b+v73l6opjIA= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=e3A2ct2ZXl6fqBqS94QH8Db3etI29vYEjYeXM/XpnAA=; b=4cGjD6I2nWoXJaszhLw5gkR8wBXtPTXqQojnHHZlWQTpjmZpzc//kjmvi9BaHXuJX1 WUyYSAscpAdo7qoP6R4Jq+xKOyEnu4eYqMFiDr1Ln3uOfu9Mmj3IxL3EV3maViQ/lv27 zCFiR3q8OljNO0Eru0goEpROgoO4m2peKcC6P0WGz1VTtxuZ4WGXxAHJENGJxsrdWxgp qXZLrLC2rVE8oHncCIWm7qSlAsShZFPBBg7o9RDfA0UqJHFhNeSUgT0JHdVVkUDghyPR QRiLmxso3dbJboBl5PK9US69n8OrzPZDCE86F8K5xtdZq/rHj/4DB6CKKISP6Rr5DhT6 4lPQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora93jYBcwFrrNJIyzL/+wQhes/6n4BpmcKuE+DfxonXQChJwzGsM 6eDbujol3Z6DVQQp/uCSbTND1ss3xIOaFJaEKveElRV1jrM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1tFtXWZHFi3am3hEHyFKy0ApiWSZx/7OC8Lr64ih+OPIB4vbe+rpsFTjriqg/9RrYysLwHGuGCVKYB6MYMZRC8= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:6a0d:0:b0:3a0:4b6e:b64e with SMTP id f13-20020a1c6a0d000000b003a04b6eb64emr16870994wmc.188.1656687737109; Fri, 01 Jul 2022 08:02:17 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Clem Cole Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2022 11:01:50 -0400 Message-ID: To: Steve Nickolas Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000013524905e2bfac47" Message-ID-Hash: VHWSJWB264HW5JQVD5YKZY4XSLJZF7BK X-Message-ID-Hash: VHWSJWB264HW5JQVD5YKZY4XSLJZF7BK X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: TUHS X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: "9 skills our grandkids won't have" - Is this a TUHS topic? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --00000000000013524905e2bfac47 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Fri, Jul 1, 2022 at 10:03 AM Steve Nickolas wrote: > On Fri, 1 Jul 2022, Nelson H. F. Beebe wrote: > > > Ctrl-D signifies end of transmission. Some other O/Ses have used > > Ctrl-Z for that purpose, presumably because Z is the final letter > > of numerous alphabets. > > I thought only CP/M and its descendants did that. :o (Of course that > includes DOS and Windows) > Steve - The social disease spread of DOS-11, RT-11, CP/M, and MS/PS-DOS used ^Z as an EOF character in their text file format. The key is that they stored a block count, not a byte count in the META. Thus the last byte needs a marker to tell the OS to stop reading. [Early DEC OS's may have done that also, but I never looked at their FS formats]. Unix, of course, never made any distinction to the core OS WRT to 'type' [other than Regular/Directory/Special] and Ken stored a character count. So there was no need to signal EOF with a markered stored on disk.. A pipe or the shell on the other hand does have a need to signal the end of a transaction, and 'End of Transmission,' as Nelson points out, is the ASCII character reserved for the same. =E1=90=A7 --00000000000013524905e2bfac47 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On F= ri, Jul 1, 2022 at 10:03 AM Steve Nickolas <usotsuki@buric.co> wrote:
On Fri, 1 Jul 2022= , Nelson H. F. Beebe wrote:

> Ctrl-D signifies end of transmission.=C2=A0 Some other O/Ses have used=
> Ctrl-Z for that purpose, presumably because Z is the final letter
> of numerous alphabets.

I thought only CP/M and its descendants did that. :o (Of course that
includes DOS and Windows)
Steve - The social disease spread of DOS-11, RT-11, CP/M, and MS/PS-= DOS used ^Z as an EOF character in their text file format.=C2=A0 The key is= that they stored a block count, not a byte count in the META.=C2=A0 =C2=A0= Thus the last byte needs a marker to tell the OS to stop reading. [Early DE= C OS's may have done that also, but I never looked at their FS formats]= .

Unix, of course,=C2=A0never = made any distinction to the core OS WRT to 'type' [other than Regul= ar/Directory/Special]=C2=A0 and Ken stored a character count.=C2=A0 So ther= e was no=C2=A0need to signal EOF with a markered stored on disk..

= A pipe or the shell on the other hand does have a n= eed to signal the end of a transaction, and 'End of Transmission,' = as Nelson points out, is the ASCII character reserved for the same.<= /div>
3D""=E1=90=A7
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