From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 20797 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2022 16:28:33 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 3 Jul 2022 16:28:33 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51B5840CBF; Mon, 4 Jul 2022 02:27:58 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-wr1-f41.google.com (mail-wr1-f41.google.com [209.85.221.41]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D281440CBE for ; Mon, 4 Jul 2022 02:27:52 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-wr1-f41.google.com with SMTP id s1so10113416wra.9 for ; Sun, 03 Jul 2022 09:27:52 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=QFU/+fX/yaG44up46iPhHq4Ognf6ZU+yMw1xfuH+VXk=; b=a06X74bnCLXOkKYMC1eN0tqM3BvbpwM6GUkFy33NplUC8x7GQp0w8EPMxA/HaQycZy 4ES9QVF3lsRW2aPsPiSVHXvdp3yW+qB1A7snzoYmgLDy3DJ5inuC5ifzzkKjycRSFbwn bEzSm9URorOiaOs15rrGJzIisjg1TPZFh+u6c= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=QFU/+fX/yaG44up46iPhHq4Ognf6ZU+yMw1xfuH+VXk=; b=77zdYFE7BlFbIahyaDRjtf5T65x00OyBXPhywK03wbiZSXHcPVVbT+PSedJC0tPCmR QsWiESaLJhI/0YQh+qMJT9DgJvK47x2H1hJU85uwCxcv/RWIXbhj3dqwAWJZEM7cL52b dncoOuEwijXgm/r/5xODvxpV18tbLxSQPJvR+zeeht+TJBfiYK6Ew/WkZW43O6UhkmrF Bbmh03Z61ZdL9ZniLPC7XDsgppPUDluNJjBV2Dh66TuaSI5H6joslQo6VyJ8siirhbzh iGrP6WyHRYTjCDthu+yNLPfCT0TsJKN1HZ0l5MFS4+RHPNJVNZyxt5ODIaKmGj9X+fgA lE7g== X-Gm-Message-State: AJIora9WS+B5oFEZ6bXFjfVDpQ/7s2nO7IpPDpaYPGMdxLewsb+nAFJH 5oViwcFA4nnH8XAwYHgvBU+2NHsN75pYSMu/t2p5zwmMR34= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGRyM1skG/8Qqnw/hG+8K3fO5XN7EJU7xB1y2uJ1AgAXAn80wh7nbAFO2921FcOvUJrUlqG2woXaxl8BYOSd9Q66Zow= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:664d:0:b0:21a:3b82:6bb2 with SMTP id f13-20020a5d664d000000b0021a3b826bb2mr23165921wrw.534.1656865611152; Sun, 03 Jul 2022 09:26:51 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20220702210244.GU11191@mcvoy.com> <20220703022743.GA15738@mcvoy.com> <20220703143906.GD18597@mcvoy.com> <5E49BE69-8869-473A-B3F5-6744566700F0@iitbombay.org> In-Reply-To: <5E49BE69-8869-473A-B3F5-6744566700F0@iitbombay.org> From: Clem Cole Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2022 12:26:25 -0400 Message-ID: To: Bakul Shah Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003191e505e2e9169f" Message-ID-Hash: FFBEEGX3FKWDAWFPFWXRVB3P75FCF4BS X-Message-ID-Hash: FFBEEGX3FKWDAWFPFWXRVB3P75FCF4BS X-MailFrom: clemc@ccc.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: steve jenkin , TUHS , Marc Donner X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Thoughts on Licenses List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --0000000000003191e505e2e9169f Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Jul 3, 2022 at 11:30 AM Bakul Shah wrote: > You may be thinking of MINIX 1. It was a from-scratch implementation that > was syscall compatible with V7 but IIRC it didn't have any sort of memory > protection as it was designed to run on 8088. Minux and specifically M1 was and always has been, a uK. And yes, M1 does not need an MMU - since it was designed to run on an 8088. IIRC this was Linus' original objection when he wanted to run on his 386-based PC (Wyse 32:16 box, IIRC). The key was Andy wanted to teach his students about V7 without running afoul of the AT&T license as Lions had with V6. What runs on the Intel Management Engine It's called the Intelligent Platform Management Interface - *a.k.a.* IPMI > is MINIX 3, ... with NetBSD userland. Actually, if you want to pick nits, neither statement is correct (remember for whom I work). MINIX 1 and MINIX 3 are related That's because M3 added the MMU support that M1 lacked. But there is nothing in M3 that IPMI is using other than it is the current version from Andy's team. What IPMI has as an underlying uK is heavily hacked and is a 'derivative work' - the local uk is basically providing V7 interfaces to some special programs. It made little sense to recreate something for the platform engine, and Minux was picked because it was smaller than any of the *BSDs and was not GPL'ed so Intel IP was still protected. =E1=90=A7 =E1=90=A7 --0000000000003191e505e2e9169f Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Sun, Jul 3, 2022 at 11:30= AM Bakul Shah <bakul@iitbombay.org> wrote:
You may be thinking of MINIX 1. It was a from-scratch i= mplementation that was syscall compatible with V7 but IIRC it didn't ha= ve any sort of memory protection as it was designed to run on 8088.
Minux and specifically M1 was and alwa= ys has been, a uK.=C2=A0 And yes, M1 does not need an MMU - since it was de= signed to run on an 8088.=C2=A0 IIRC this was Linus'=C2=A0original=C2= =A0objection when he wanted to run on his 386-based PC (Wyse 32:16 box, IIR= C). The key was Andy wanted to teach his=C2=A0students about V7 without run= ning afoul of the AT&T license as Lions had with V6.

What runs on the Inte= l Management Engine
It's c= alled the=C2=A0Intelligent Platform Management Interface - a.k.a.<= /i> IPMI
=C2=A0is MINIX 3, ...=C2=A0with NetBSD userland.
=
Actually, if you want to pick nits, neither= statement is correct (remember for whom I work).=C2=A0

=C2=A0MINIX 1 and MINIX 3 are related=C2=A0
That's because M3 added the MMU support that M1 lacked= .=C2=A0=C2=A0 But there is nothin= g in M3 that IPMI is using other than it is the current version from Andy&#= 39;s team.=C2=A0 What IPMI has as an underlying=C2=A0uK is heavily hacked a= nd is a 'derivative work' - the local uk is basically providing V7 = interfaces to some special programs.=C2=A0 =C2=A0
<= span class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-seri= f">
It made little sense to recreate something for the platform engine= , and Minux was picked because it was smaller than any of the *BSDs and was= not GPL'ed so Intel IP was still protected.=C2=A0 =C2=A0=
=E1=90=A7
3D""=E1=90=A7
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