From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: (qmail 16012 invoked from network); 6 Apr 2020 00:28:41 -0000 Received-SPF: pass (minnie.tuhs.org: domain of minnie.tuhs.org designates 45.79.103.53 as permitted sender) receiver=inbox.vuxu.org; client-ip=45.79.103.53 envelope-from= Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with UTF8ESMTPZ; 6 Apr 2020 00:28:41 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id B71549448F; Mon, 6 Apr 2020 10:28:39 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF92294485; Mon, 6 Apr 2020 10:28:11 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (1024-bit key; unprotected) header.d=ccc.com header.i=@ccc.com header.b="mHYHqxYq"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 3367594485; Mon, 6 Apr 2020 10:28:08 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-qk1-f180.google.com (mail-qk1-f180.google.com [209.85.222.180]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A00A694484 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 2020 10:28:07 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-qk1-f180.google.com with SMTP id h14so14581634qke.5 for ; Sun, 05 Apr 2020 17:28:07 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=abC9DSLXtO9hkDAt1WjJnnmKMyTjpf46aqUneHgJFK4=; b=mHYHqxYq43Yu5YrbYy8hsfyBNP4tMofs5p4ihu6u6839cAMd90nGVgevxAZGOBBj6R x3MMCtlTNDnCXL15akI/HlazO/h5WlQKQt9TgddXzPV63ghnkZdE9VOrNg5XbbnpqSzD 8cNxc4Rdlgq4jyWFsle4knIlVdtEtMwLlIYiI= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=abC9DSLXtO9hkDAt1WjJnnmKMyTjpf46aqUneHgJFK4=; b=C8H2uJ1m7gVvf+//mzWug1PTKEUZ6/Q8eXiGq095cD6q1yo3LBGKO1SO+cz6p2VJYk r9efN9xged3bgE64y06FUETNHOBgYgBapAyGmBUKuD+4usmCuN5SGIuMHwUxDBK+ZRag /CJfip+SGN+4uEwZGjs11bhS6DhTGTe81zbFzKXe3I02JTQzD9SB7bBOGPuRVzLBaMrD b1d2Mw3Bj0Y5uOBqAwDvTYWgCRBZSfNn+oqJSZO9D/SvfUrCwImPJ6CEzxHLhJN2oG2c LLPOIS0xxlZtCzJTs+8nPE0Pv1A0xOfTrl1vDIgf5rMOdyccOlw8Vgf80EwSlsorjmsF VtRA== X-Gm-Message-State: AGi0Pub++xqyqHHS3/33WzaOzHyEsVG4+XHnLImgJmky0GbPFqGWLCqT PFsmD6x3JscYaNgXTvJjx7vdnG8fDKhWu7x65n4B0WNk658= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APiQypLQOwdJYzFGYgjaQSoz3C/nTs+/JiyfZl3FgCMUK/EsPXd1EFhN6B3aHoSMNPSq9ekoiMDVGIWJvV32a5lmshE= X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:668:: with SMTP id a8mr8701186qkh.307.1586132886452; Sun, 05 Apr 2020 17:28:06 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <1jKkMQ-2hN-00@marmaro.de> <854f7b58-9ba0-476f-a7e6-8579f4a8048d@localhost> <1jKlvG-4JB-00@marmaro.de> <3A36FF0A-7617-4B26-B4F3-FC183BF9A7FC@ronnatalie.com> <20200406000814.GH25105@mcvoy.com> In-Reply-To: <20200406000814.GH25105@mcvoy.com> From: Clem Cole Date: Sun, 5 Apr 2020 20:27:40 -0400 Message-ID: To: Larry McVoy Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000438e3405a29457f8" Subject: Re: [TUHS] First book on Unix for general readership X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --000000000000438e3405a29457f8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Two thoughts ... 1.) Lion's was not a general book. It really was more of a kernel 'here-is-how-the-magic-happens.' It's still the best I know for that. BTW: it did not leak. It was purchasable from WE. But the cost was high and it was hard to get (you had a price you had a license and could not buy/order it at any book store - I don't think it had an ISBN or a library congress number originally). I know a couple of the schools (like CMU) wanted to use it for the OS course, but there was some hang-up associated with it in the mid-70s, which I don't remember - we did have a couple of sections passed out for a few lecture. But because of how it was bound (and short), it was photocopied s others have pointed out. I think Michigan managed to use the whole thing for their OS course, as I seem to remember that both Ted Kowalski and Bill Joy got copies there (although my memory is that they both had photocopies not the original Orange and Red bindings). Ted brought it to CMU, which is how I first saw it (and I think my original copy was a duplicate of his). And I remember seeing a photocopy in wnj's office at UCB. The first time I saw the official Red/Orange bound version was when I ordered it at Tektronix from WE a few years later, but I had to leave it there when I went back to grad school. 2.) The question asked about general 'Unix' text -- my favorite is still Rob and Brian's and I still recommend it (particularly to learn how to >>use<< UNIX/Linux today by doing the exercises), but it was not first. Steve's certainly was early and I thought it was a good explanation and until Rob and Brian became available was what I suggested when people asked. In fact, early Masscomp system's shipped Bourne's text, until Tim wrote the original 'UNIX In a Nutshell' that started his empire. That said, I do seem to remember there was another book around the same time (79-80 ish) that had a light blue cover that came from one 'PC-press' publishers. I wish I could remember the author and the name. I remember looking at a copy in Powell's in Portland when it came out and not being impressed. On Sun, Apr 5, 2020 at 8:08 PM Larry McVoy wrote: > Do the Bell Labs technical journals count? I have a collection of Unix > papers that were puled out and published together in two volumes. That > stuff was a gold mine of information in the 80's. > > On Sun, Apr 05, 2020 at 07:57:55PM -0400, Ronald Natalie wrote: > > The Lions book wasn???t really published back in the day. It was only > targetted at his students in Australia (though copies leaked out). > > > > The manuals aren???t really a book (and again, they weren???t really > published as a book) and most of the prose on UNIX was more in the form of > articles than an entire book. > > -- > --- > Larry McVoy lm at mcvoy.com > http://www.mcvoy.com/lm > --000000000000438e3405a29457f8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Two thoughts ...

1.) Lion's wa= s not a general book.=C2=A0 It really was more of a kernel 'here-is-how= -the-magic-happens.'=C2=A0 =C2=A0It's still the best I know for tha= t.=C2=A0 BTW:=C2=A0 it did not leak.=C2=A0 It was purchasable from WE.=C2= =A0 =C2=A0But the cost was high and it was hard to get (you had a price you= had a license and could not buy/order it at any=C2=A0book store - I don= 9;t think it had an ISBN or a library congress number originally).
=
I know a couple of the schools (like CMU) wanted to use it for= the OS course, but there was some hang-up associated with it in the mid-70= s, which I don't remember - we did have a couple of sections passed out= for a few lecture.=C2=A0 But because of how it was bound (and short), it w= as photocopied s others have pointed out.=C2=A0

I thin= k Michigan managed to use the=C2=A0whole thing for their OS course, as I se= em to remember that both Ted Kowalski and Bill Joy got copies there (althou= gh my memory is that they both had photocopies not the original Orange and = Red bindings).=C2=A0 Ted brought it to CMU, which=C2=A0is how I first saw i= t (and I think my original copy was a duplicate of his). And I remember see= ing a photocopy in wnj's office at UCB.=C2=A0 The first time=C2=A0I saw= the=C2=A0official=C2=A0Red/Orange bound version was when I ordered=C2=A0it= at Tektronix from WE a few years=C2=A0later, but I had to leave it there w= hen I went back to grad school.


2.) The= question asked about general 'Unix' text -- my favorite is still R= ob and=C2=A0Brian's and I still recommend it (particularly to learn how= to >>use<< UNIX/Linux today by doing the exercises), but it wa= s not first.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Steve's certainly was early and I thought it w= as a good explanation and until Rob and Brian became available was what I s= uggested when people asked.=C2=A0 In fact, early Masscomp system's ship= ped Bourne's text, until Tim wrote the original 'UNIX In a Nutshell= ' that started his empire.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 That said, I do seem to remembe= r there was another book around the same time (79-80 ish) that had a light = blue cover that came from one 'PC-press' publishers.=C2=A0 =C2=A0I = wish I could remember the author and the name.=C2=A0 I remember looking at = a copy in Powell's in Portland when it came out and not being impressed= .

On Sun, Apr 5, 2020 at 8:08 PM Larry McVoy <lm@mcvoy.com> wrote:
Do the Bell Labs technical journal= s count?=C2=A0 I have a collection of Unix
papers that were puled out and published together in two volumes.=C2=A0 Tha= t
stuff was a gold mine of information in the 80's.

On Sun, Apr 05, 2020 at 07:57:55PM -0400, Ronald Natalie wrote:
> The Lions book wasn???t really published back in the day.=C2=A0 =C2=A0= It was only targetted at his students in Australia (though copies leaked ou= t).
>
> The manuals aren???t really a book (and again, they weren???t really p= ublished as a book) and most of the prose on UNIX was more in the form of a= rticles than an entire book.

--
---
Larry McVoy=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 l= m at mcvo= y.com=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0http://www.mcvoy.com= /lm
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