From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 2231 invoked from network); 25 Apr 2021 17:47:38 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 25 Apr 2021 17:47:38 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 72E889C852; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 03:47:37 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21D629C835; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 03:47:05 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (1024-bit key; unprotected) header.d=ccc.com header.i=@ccc.com header.b="sjz1n7h5"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 5095C9C835; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 03:47:01 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-qk1-f169.google.com (mail-qk1-f169.google.com [209.85.222.169]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1679D9C834 for ; Mon, 26 Apr 2021 03:46:59 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-qk1-f169.google.com with SMTP id x11so54397895qkp.11 for ; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 10:46:59 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccc.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ga5YAGosvSaCk2kC93IqARVzdYT85Z2Z6measEmZ7TE=; b=sjz1n7h55yyfOZhWmjj/KMwm7+eQe5PIUXUWp7aQFVQxettpS2TlpgNgI/6/qWM3x/ AOOQRlI4/KtZaKI5UZfiDHd//eeETtysPw7iL97Rrg1vk9J36eYSr+QXNZmBKnA2BKvi GMu+vHBTh3/PfrJG7OnyzFkjFxf7WcpiLuCGo= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ga5YAGosvSaCk2kC93IqARVzdYT85Z2Z6measEmZ7TE=; b=FDTHQwzXYXK7CqAT1CYueiJvwnT6BL/NVAaR/m8uWI54+v4qVY6ZmgvUt+gy16E0DP vq35A76zhKQNCSbjp5X/xNRZawwgetia4gc8YN621HG8EE9BNUZ+tSKWWgGtuHPYRv5M XwIURFjCFRPG25paOHrM3t/Dt+TUlknksXnfpW7iY5l6OdrIrXIlKZXNAW1U6JPRC5Wq 4v5o80wEEcc/kvH7pKe6ipBcqyfpt+7qUSJxPmhJJ6vODDxGb+Om+DN9g+MXhP6p8oPo AEah+qdNhXPwHgvtne6Lh5/KvAYInar627lJS+XtapzaK2Oc9qaAlhglVRMUaZNdgQf+ X3nQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5317cwudOJfXxHz9I13RJ87dX2krahzIvMC5hFMoNfqtyy8hxRgM vFQ1ai7Dm0Yfq/BjJNnCrGyA23ryqfPkQCHyTKjwLhAhu5o= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzHLezDSCddS9zi8NkrlvQ02yVIyL4gn58/yMKm5/B1TZhix7yPf1Zxja+EXAq1q26WFOUB3/hT3I4geEwIKfU= X-Received: by 2002:a37:9607:: with SMTP id y7mr13980187qkd.25.1619372818109; Sun, 25 Apr 2021 10:46:58 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <15D66A4F-D935-4313-93C8-CBB66039E0BD@planet.nl> <202104251249.13PCnaFV031741@freefriends.org> <202104251732.13PHWb3o006219@freefriends.org> In-Reply-To: <202104251732.13PHWb3o006219@freefriends.org> From: Clem Cole Date: Sun, 25 Apr 2021 13:46:31 -0400 Message-ID: To: Aharon Robbins Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009526fb05c0cf9dad" Subject: Re: [TUHS] pcc in 8th edition X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list , Paul Ruizendaal Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --0000000000009526fb05c0cf9dad Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable No worries, I already did -- but I also sent it back to the pubs' folks at USENIX. They have slowing scanning the print archives on an as-needed basis; which is where it belongs. =E1=90=A7 On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 1:32 PM wrote: > And maybe give to Warren too? :-) > > Clem Cole wrote: > > > yes i'll mail under separate cover a scan > > =E1=90=A7 > > > > On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 11:47 AM Paul Ruizendaal wrote: > > > > > By now found some more clues, in particular this link: > > > > http://computer-programming-forum.com/47-c-language/fab825b2dce1aa59.htm > > > > > > Apparently I am talking about PCC and PCC2 in the below question. > > > > > > The first post mentions 4 papers. They can be found online, apart fro= m > the > > > USENIX one: > > > "Four Generations of Portable C Compiler" by D.M. Kristol (1986 Summe= r > > > USENIX Conference Proceedings) > > > > > > Anybody have that? > > > > > > The second post mentions official documentation: > > > > > > "In porting QCC, a useful text is the "Portable C Compiler - > > > Version 2 (PCC2) Internals". It includes documentation of > > > stin file formats, PCC2 tree forms, debugging flags, and > > > compiler #defines. The manual is expensive so it's worth it > > > most if you buy it before you figure it all out doing a > > > port. Since the manual is based on PCC2 (and hasn't been > > > updated), it's a good starting point, but doesn't have the > > > latest information.=E2=80=9D > > > > > > Anybody have that? (It is not on bitsavers) > > > > > > Paul > > > > > > > On 25 Apr 2021, at 14:49, arnold@skeeve.com wrote: > > > > > > > > Not an answer to your questions, but you may want to take a look > > > > at the PCC Revived project. It lives in CVS, but I have a git > mirror at > > > > git://github.com/arnoldrobbins/pcc-revived > > > > > > > > HTH, > > > > > > > > Arnold > > > > > > > > Paul Ruizendaal wrote: > > > > > > > >> For clarity and ease of reference: > > > >> > > > >> - The =E2=80=9CTour of paper=E2=80=9D is for instance here: > > > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=3D10.1.1.48.3512 < > > > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=3D10.1.1.48.3512> > > > >> > > > >> - A machine description for the VAX that matches with that paper i= s > for > > > instance in the SysIII source: > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DSysIII/usr/src/cmd/cc/vax/pc= c/table.c > > > < > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DSysIII/usr/src/cmd/cc/vax/pc= c/table.c > > > > > > > >> > > > >> - The new style description in 8th edition is here: > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/vax/stin= < > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/vax/stin= > > > > >> > > > >> - The program that translates the =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D file to a= =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D file is > > > here: > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/common/s= ty.y > > > < > > > > https://www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/common/s= ty.y > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D > > > >> > > > >> Sometimes one thing leads to another. > > > >> > > > >> Following the recent mention of some retro-brew 68K single board > > > systems, I decided to build a CB030 board (in progress). I figure it > is a > > > rough proxy for a 1980 VAX and would allow for some experimentation > with > > > the 32V / SysIII / 8th edition code. > > > >> > > > >> My first thought was to use the M68K compiler that is included wit= h > the > > > Blit sources (see THUS Archive for this), as I had used that before t= o > > > explore some of the Blit source. That compiler is LP32, not ILP32 - > which > > > may be a source of trouble. Just changing the SZINT parameter yielded > some > > > issues, so I started looking at the PCC source. > > > >> > > > >> This source does not have a =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D in the well = known format as > > > described in the =E2=80=9CA tour of the portable C compiler=E2=80=9D = paper. Instead it > uses > > > a file =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D which appears to be in a more compact f= ormat and is > > > translated into a =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D file by a new pre-process= or ("sty.y=E2=80=9D). Then > > > looking at the VAX compilers for 8th and 10th edition, these too use > this > > > =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D file. > > > >> > > > >> All the other m68K compilers (based on pcc) that I found appear to > > > derive from the V7/32V/SysIII lineage, not from the 8th edition > lineage. > > > >> > > > >> A quick google did not yield much background or documentation on t= he > > > STY format. > > > >> > > > >> Anybody on this list that can shed some light on the history of th= e > STY > > > table and on how to use it? Any surviving reports or memos that would > be > > > useful? > > > >> > > > >> Many thanks in advance > > > >> > > > >> Paul > > > >> > > > > > > > --0000000000009526fb05c0cf9dad Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
No worries, I already did -- but I also sent it=C2=A0ba= ck to=C2=A0the pubs' folks at USENIX.=C2=A0 They have slowing scanning = the print archives on an as-needed basis; which is where it belongs.
<= /div>
3D""=E1=90=A7

On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 1:32 PM <arnold@skeeve.com> wrote:
And maybe give to Warren too? :-)
Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.= com> wrote:

> yes=C2=A0 i'll mail under separate cover a scan
> =E1=90=A7
>
> On Sun, Apr 25, 2021 at 11:47 AM Paul Ruizendaal <pnr@planet.nl> wrote:
>
> > By now found some more clues, in particular this link:
> > http://computer-pr= ogramming-forum.com/47-c-language/fab825b2dce1aa59.htm
> >
> > Apparently I am talking about PCC and PCC2 in the below question.=
> >
> > The first post mentions 4 papers. They can be found online, apart= from the
> > USENIX one:
> > "Four Generations of Portable C Compiler" by D.M. Krist= ol (1986 Summer
> > USENIX Conference Proceedings)
> >
> > Anybody have that?
> >
> > The second post mentions official documentation:
> >
> > "In porting QCC, a useful text is the "Portable C Compi= ler -
> > Version 2 (PCC2) Internals".=C2=A0 It includes documentation= of
> > stin file formats, PCC2 tree forms, debugging flags, and
> > compiler #defines.=C2=A0 The manual is expensive so it's wort= h it
> > most if you buy it before you figure it all out doing a
> > port.=C2=A0 Since the manual is based on PCC2 (and hasn't bee= n
> > updated), it's a good starting point, but doesn't have th= e
> > latest information.=E2=80=9D
> >
> > Anybody have that? (It is not on bitsavers)
> >
> > Paul
> >
> > > On 25 Apr 2021, at 14:49, arnold@skeeve.com wrote:
> > >
> > > Not an answer to your questions, but you may want to take a = look
> > > at the PCC Revived project.=C2=A0 It lives in CVS, but I hav= e a git mirror at
> > > git://github.com/arnoldrobbins/pcc-revived=
> > >
> > > HTH,
> > >
> > > Arnold
> > >
> > > Paul Ruizendaal <pnr@planet.nl> wrote:
> > >
> > >> For clarity and ease of reference:
> > >>
> > >> - The =E2=80=9CTour of paper=E2=80=9D is for instance he= re:
> > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.= edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=3D10.1.1.48.3512 <
> > http://citeseerx.ist.psu.= edu/viewdoc/summary?doi=3D10.1.1.48.3512>
> > >>
> > >> - A machine description for the VAX that matches with th= at paper is for
> > instance in the SysIII source:
> > https://= www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DSysIII/usr/src/cmd/cc/vax/pcc/table.c<= /a>
> > <
> > https://= www.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DSysIII/usr/src/cmd/cc/vax/pcc/table.c<= /a>
> > >
> > >>
> > >> - The new style description in 8th edition is here:
> > https://www.tuhs.= org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/vax/stin <
> > https://www.tuhs.= org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/vax/stin>
> > >>
> > >> - The program that translates the =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D= file to a =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D file is
> > here:
> > https://www.t= uhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/common/sty.y
> > <
> > https://www.t= uhs.org/cgi-bin/utree.pl?file=3DV8/usr/src/cmd/ccom/common/sty.y
> > >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> =3D=3D=3D=3D
> > >>
> > >> Sometimes one thing leads to another.
> > >>
> > >> Following the recent mention of some retro-brew 68K sing= le board
> > systems, I decided to build a CB030 board (in progress). I figure= it is a
> > rough proxy for a 1980 VAX and would allow for some experimentati= on with
> > the 32V / SysIII / 8th edition code.
> > >>
> > >> My first thought was to use the M68K compiler that is in= cluded with the
> > Blit sources (see THUS Archive for this), as I had used that befo= re to
> > explore some of the Blit source. That compiler is LP32, not ILP32= - which
> > may be a source of trouble. Just changing the SZINT parameter yie= lded some
> > issues, so I started looking at the PCC source.
> > >>
> > >> This source does not have a =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D in= the well known format as
> > described in the =E2=80=9CA tour of the portable C compiler=E2=80= =9D paper. Instead it uses
> > a file =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D which appears to be in a more compa= ct format and is
> > translated into a =E2=80=9Ctable.c=E2=80=9D file by a new pre-pro= cessor ("sty.y=E2=80=9D). Then
> > looking at the VAX compilers for 8th and 10th edition, these too = use this
> > =E2=80=9Cstin=E2=80=9D file.
> > >>
> > >> All the other m68K compilers (based on pcc) that I found= appear to
> > derive from the V7/32V/SysIII lineage, not from the 8th edition l= ineage.
> > >>
> > >> A quick google did not yield much background or document= ation on the
> > STY format.
> > >>
> > >> Anybody on this list that can shed some light on the his= tory of the STY
> > table and on how to use it? Any surviving reports or memos that w= ould be
> > useful?
> > >>
> > >> Many thanks in advance
> > >>
> > >> Paul
> > >>
> >
> >
--0000000000009526fb05c0cf9dad--