From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 22797 invoked from network); 13 Mar 2023 03:26:18 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 13 Mar 2023 03:26:18 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DFEE415D0; Mon, 13 Mar 2023 13:26:13 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ua1-x92b.google.com (mail-ua1-x92b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::92b]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BB6B941579 for ; Mon, 13 Mar 2023 13:26:05 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ua1-x92b.google.com with SMTP id s23so7326115uae.5 for ; Sun, 12 Mar 2023 20:26:05 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ccil-org.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; t=1678677964; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=jRzWd8DKRgAm9uBWyyXByDJipgwNNYYWsLU0Uhn2iJo=; b=1tklsn3zGBuvrtigAIZsTzHhb1nDI5CtHx/d/GT1/Ed5R+WGkJ1k4tfF8GbIW6bp0d sCaQD7WuLcaaaYXBTh82yJ/p8QPDwpIgR+sOO717mSGZs+e4AY0lw9AL0Um7bqfh/bZe R+zcIDorGpiz5kSsiuz5CrCYUdmMqhAqycoEZ3rvUxfr32EhPXJsUMiGA6DkhgeCFG8K tNO3i3k75rUt7A6HUMiRlvf/0B2EKH6u8YCK6PXChjZd5qL/TPNJhhX6eAW2SEyEt+T6 BTfZi8jR/cWsB5h5Q8cTkIzYbcwQ5KaKBW+B/sL1jTPKo+U1TR3zjblhmMHyYIsPBp+p FNQg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; t=1678677964; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=jRzWd8DKRgAm9uBWyyXByDJipgwNNYYWsLU0Uhn2iJo=; b=NnOmYWMKFbXz3p3aMrXpyAj4JcyimgBmTG7aZzRC+T6hmgOHrKJvsVd5hTlTB9Tu2A B74+K5kfeqojPz7st1H2gF/7iC2W5m9OrufKfqtslfhA2M2PQ0yGoEoyWTnmBiYipx3p jJmCQckjB7zxvz99a6okSiyaag2InHgDn8w7nSn5mXiJcIxrmSFOt67vQJAgyOCh/XPF 7282wDbRbBge3R14qdu37Xn7IjkryjgWu8qh0gmS66yUaAqvS3n5xAGsGuo1KBsIK+el ZT02247ZV6ram3YXAZtYqY+8aq88ZBzJqetJbets+ewJ/rSpSq1n1kECKete4vdpP/mM mVGA== X-Gm-Message-State: AO0yUKUQl7ozsOfRaA1NeHH5FwA7URH/jUxENk9oavq7Y2v3lAwZexWo yEbrVuiGD8HZboAlB9Q7stjXI/aDN0Pvs4cBZPrP8A== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AK7set9Q3kzrIpYF8ZbREuDBcXi9cBwp7Z5//kgZYgzBx6lKL3aJhDwQOqimblR9LjMPnNmILfnnXROPFRzu6JaAXGY= X-Received: by 2002:ab0:5402:0:b0:68a:a9d:13f5 with SMTP id n2-20020ab05402000000b0068a0a9d13f5mr20790190uaa.1.1678677964722; Sun, 12 Mar 2023 20:26:04 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20230310113708.AD55518C080@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: From: John Cowan Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2023 23:25:53 -0400 Message-ID: To: Dan Cross Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c7af3a05f6bfab90" Message-ID-Hash: YO3MEDHD25GSGD6U27PS7MOBW6V4MTFU X-Message-ID-Hash: YO3MEDHD25GSGD6U27PS7MOBW6V4MTFU X-MailFrom: cowan@ccil.org X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: TUHS X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: I can't drive 55: "GOTO considered harmful" 55th anniversary List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000c7af3a05f6bfab90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Sun, Mar 12, 2023 at 7:40=E2=80=AFAM Dan Cross wrote: > It is certainly a shame that modern compiler writers have become > essentially hostile to programmers in their pursuit of ever more aggressi= ve > optimizations based on rigid readings of the standard, common sense be > damned. > Not at all. It is clear that mainstream C and C++ compilers optimize for the features most important to mainstream C and C++ programmers, which are: 1) Execution speed. 2) Execution speed. 3) I lied; there is no 3. If those are not your priorities, use a non-mainstream compiler or a different programming language. --000000000000c7af3a05f6bfab90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On Su= n, Mar 12, 2023 at 7:40=E2=80=AFAM Dan Cross <crossd@gmail.com> wrote:
=C2=A0
It is certainly a shame th= at modern compiler writers have become essentially hostile to programmers i= n their pursuit of ever more aggressive optimizations based on rigid readin= gs of the standard, common sense be damned.
Not at all.=C2=A0 It is clear that mainst= ream C and C++ compilers optimize for the features most important to mainst= ream C and C++ programmers, which are:

<= /div>
1) Execution speed.

2) Execution speed.

3) I lied; there is = no 3.

If= those are not your priorities, use a non-mainstream compiler or a differen= t programming language.
--000000000000c7af3a05f6bfab90--