From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FROM,HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 32111 invoked from network); 2 Dec 2021 05:45:42 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 2 Dec 2021 05:45:42 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 86D4C9CE82; Thu, 2 Dec 2021 15:45:38 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 178E79CD65; Thu, 2 Dec 2021 15:45:00 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b="jcJZuUdh"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 457639C78B; Thu, 2 Dec 2021 15:44:46 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-pj1-f54.google.com (mail-pj1-f54.google.com [209.85.216.54]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4F6E09C78B for ; Thu, 2 Dec 2021 15:44:45 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-pj1-f54.google.com with SMTP id n15-20020a17090a160f00b001a75089daa3so1578379pja.1 for ; Wed, 01 Dec 2021 21:44:45 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ATd8RdeymrCE1Z84768cPgk4Mpi6UpS8OL0Z0MzKAVc=; b=jcJZuUdh7Iwh/nhYOmZkHuf58hpTC9OTqA185rtopMuWF10ljEGkU/P+WHmiPa7C9A eLFEwS87+BugqKd3D80pZDECUc66vRZ4hS27QG4crSp4Y6rNCAr3+TtwreJVGbGPDn46 ZHNLMA4FLueoIIv+QDZyJ7DQDE7tWkQAmb2Ye4tt3OyxBibAWp0aWbwuxbByY2y7FGcS Bls87Gt2GFTDlYvCEQs+MGTXi6ks6mfXiV792Xzl85/FGnt4WzOzGutgzWuNjHK9Isk3 VITC6k+DlTESmU8MZ0yFKWfZOkRQ+OJxm27rjrMSAKITa4GmDS9w7ri1m55z0GROOif1 pjZw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ATd8RdeymrCE1Z84768cPgk4Mpi6UpS8OL0Z0MzKAVc=; b=SGPNT3ULnDP+dIm50bkyD/93b0APf8H3rm+iGbYwQ/gMziktJey/nT0UWiGFwboQY9 x/bMx1hL4HNlEiDmGH4uu/OopmfZJQRNvEiEtlJKeW31F7JC/aSmXIKKPazXkY27LBMo /xGB82hr+JqZzeb5d1nKb8iK/HK7BSivsUuPMHZSBPAnDKXHfMcB6sWrr/HTinSR6Fbv IA0HxkUzLdG92czjQbHwo0IkmvwHjGulIoaPlNBO6CxYF1MbEseZjxGXMymc0PFfIXJ6 lpbdK6YbWtsjxqfpTcYdFog3ajRImzM1clHwgeOyzdDT47ID/kFNYeY2tx7xrwNdP8sV DpZw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533Z2AIzZTeHfStjhrGF8lvi8uv6juAawMF/oG1EyGLGZIqPnQv+ UperIR2XHd4oK9H921RDsBWQ0d+C5HDDEvkcq+I= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz426LUmTyZYtfb3zHJoopowlRuJOUgWAnG56jagTgVekjhikWczqQCsVtDipr9ollMQMvor49vTFTxlwdcyEA= X-Received: by 2002:a17:903:2306:b0:141:e52e:457d with SMTP id d6-20020a170903230600b00141e52e457dmr13069984plh.3.1638423884579; Wed, 01 Dec 2021 21:44:44 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <4186ba55-8c1d-9a7b-f7f7-f45a86d3fe0c@solar.stanford.edu> In-Reply-To: From: Henry Bent Date: Thu, 2 Dec 2021 00:44:33 -0500 Message-ID: To: Clem Cole Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a1c3e105d223491c" Subject: Re: [TUHS] Ratfor revived! X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --000000000000a1c3e105d223491c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you, Clem. I am working on getting the tools running in DOSBox, which seemed most straightforward. The Byte article (the scan of which I am very grateful for; not having to go trawling through the stacks at the Oberlin College library is always a plus) claims that the tools have been implemented on: ACOS Amdahl Apollo AN/UYK Burroughs CDC Cray Data General DEC FACOM GEC HP HITAC Honeywell IBM Intel Interdata Modcomp Multics NCR Perkin-Elmer Prime Rolm SEL Tandem Univac Wang Xerox CP/M Machines MS/DOS Machines UNIX Machines Which is quite the list; I've never even heard of a few of those! Based on the files in the UNIX Archive, am I to assume that most of those ports took advantage of a native Pascal compiler? That's how I'm planning to bring the tools up on my local RT-11 machine. -Henry On Wed, 1 Dec 2021 at 19:34, Clem Cole wrote: > https://www.tuhs.org/Archive/Applications/Software_Tools/ > =E1=90=A7 > > On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 5:25 PM Henry Bent wrote: > >> On Wed, 1 Dec 2021 at 17:17, Deborah Scherrer < >> dscherrer@solar.stanford.edu> wrote: >> >>> All you folks revisiting the Software Tools should remember that there >>> was an entire movement around the first book, based at Lawrence Berkele= y >>> Lab. The Software Tools group, an offshoot of Usenix, had about 2000 >>> members. We created an almost-entire Unix environment based on a virtu= al >>> operating system that we designed, inspired of course by Kernighan's >>> ideas. The collection was ported to over 50 operating systems, includi= ng >>> some without file systems. This is all still freely available, and st= ored >>> with the Unix archives. >>> >> Could you provide a link to said environment, and suggest what sort of >> machines it might have run on? I probably have something here that will= do >> it, and I am very interested. >> >> -Henry >> >> >>> On 12/1/21 12:59 PM, Clem Cole wrote: >>> >>> Arnold -- sounds fun. Thank you!!! I'll add it to my growing pile of >>> things I want to play with at some point. I too had a wonderful child= hood >>> experience with the SW tools. Somebody had a number of them running on= a >>> VMS box when all we had was the VMS Fortran compiler, no C yet. >>> >>> I am curious why did you decide to use byacc? I would have thought in >>> a desire to modernize and make it more available on a modern system -- = was >>> there something in byacc that could not be done easily in bison? To b= e >>> honest, I had thought Robert Corbett did them both and bison was the >>> successor to byacc, but I'm not a compiler guy - so I'm suspecting that >>> there must be a difference/reason. As I said, this is purely curiosit= y -- >>> an educational opportunity. >>> >>> Thanks again, >>> Clem >>> =E1=90=A7 >>> >>> On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:41 PM Arnold Robbins wrote= : >>> >>>> Hi All. >>>> >>>> Mainly for fun (sic), I decided to revive the Ratfor (Rational >>>> Fortran) preprocessor. Please see: >>>> >>>> https://github.com/arnoldrobbins/ratfor >>>> >>>> I started with the V6 code, then added the V7, V8 and V10 versions >>>> on top of it. Each one has its own branch so that you can look >>>> at the original code, if you wish. The man page and the paper from >>>> the V7 manual are also included. >>>> >>>> Starting with the Tenth Edition version, I set about to modernize >>>> the code and get it to compile and run on a modern-day system. >>>> (ANSI style declarations and function headers, modern include files, >>>> use of getopt, and most importantly, correct use of Yacc yyval and >>>> yylval variables.) >>>> >>>> You will need Berkely Yacc installed as byacc in order to build it. >>>> >>>> I have only touch-tested it, but so far it seems OK. 'make' runs in >>>> like 2 >>>> seconds, really quick. On my Ubuntu Linux systems, it compiles with >>>> no warnings. >>>> >>>> I hope to eventually add a test suite also, if I can steal some time. >>>> >>>> Before anyone asks, no, I don't think anybody today has any real use >>>> for it. This was simply "for fun", and because Ratfor has a soft >>>> spot in my heart. "Software Tools" was, for me, the most influential >>>> programming book that I ever read. I don't think there's a better >>>> book to convey the "zen" of Unix. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Arnold >>>> >>> --000000000000a1c3e105d223491c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you, Clem.=C2=A0 I am working on getting the to= ols running in DOSBox, which seemed most straightforward.

The Byte article (the scan of which I am very grateful for; not hav= ing to go trawling through the stacks at the Oberlin College library is alw= ays a plus) claims that the tools have been implemented on:

<= /div>
ACOS
Amdahl
Apollo
AN/UYK
Burroughs
CDC
Cray
Data General
DE= C
FACOM
GEC
HP
HITAC
Hone= ywell
IBM
Intel
Interdata
Modcomp
Multics
NCR
Perkin-Elmer
Prime
=
Rolm
SEL
Tandem
Univac
Wang
Xerox
CP/M Machines
MS/DOS Machines
U= NIX Machines

Which is quite the list; I've nev= er even heard of a few of those!=C2=A0 Based on the files in the UNIX Archi= ve, am I to assume that most of those ports took advantage of a native Pasc= al compiler?=C2=A0 That's how I'm planning to bring the tools up on= my local RT-11 machine.

-Henry
=
= On Wed, 1 Dec 2021 at 19:34, Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote:
3D""<= font size=3D"1" color=3D"#ffffff">=E1=90=A7

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 5:= 25 PM Henry Bent <henry.r.bent@gmail.com> wrote:
On Wed, 1 Dec= 2021 at 17:17, Deborah Scherrer <dscherrer@solar.stanford.edu> wrote:
=
=20 =20 =20

All you folks revisiting the Software Tools should remember that there was an entire movement around the first book, based at Lawrence Berkeley Lab.=C2=A0 The Software Tools group, an offshoot of Usenix, had about 2000 members.=C2=A0 We created an almost-entire Uni= x environment based on a virtual operating system that we designed, inspired of course by Kernighan's ideas.=C2=A0 The collection was ported to over 50 operating systems, including some without file systems.=C2=A0=C2=A0 This is all still freely available, and stored w= ith the Unix archives.

Could you provide a link to= said environment, and suggest what sort of machines it might have run on?= =C2=A0 I probably have something here that will do it, and I am very intere= sted.

-Henry
=C2=A0
=20
On 12/1/21 12:59 PM, Clem Cole wrote:
=20
Arnold -- sounds fun.=C2=A0 Thank you!!!=C2=A0 I'll add it to my growin= g pile of things I want to play with at some point.=C2=A0 =C2=A0I too had a wonderful childhood experience with the SW tools.=C2=A0 Somebody had a number of them running on a VMS box when all we had was the VMS Fortran compiler, no C yet.

I am curious why did you decide=C2=A0to use byacc?=C2=A0 =C2=A0I would have th= ought in a desire to modernize and make it more available on a modern system -- was there something in byacc that could not be done easily in bison?=C2=A0 =C2=A0To be honest, I had thought=C2=A0Robert Corbett did them both and bison was the successor to byacc, but I'm not a compiler=C2=A0guy - so I'm suspecting that there=C2=A0must = be a difference/reason.=C2=A0 =C2=A0As I said, this is purely curios= ity=C2=A0-- an educational opportunity.

Thanks = again,
Clem
3D""==E1=90=A7

On Wed, Dec 1, 2021 at 3:41 P= M Arnold Robbins <arnold@skeeve.com> wrote:
Hi All.

Mainly for fun (sic), I decided to revive the Ratfor (Rational Fortran) preprocessor.=C2=A0 Please see:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://github.com/arno= ldrobbins/ratfor

I started with the V6 code, then added the V7, V8 and V10 versions
on top of it. Each one has its own branch so that you can look at the original code, if you wish. The man page and the paper from
the V7 manual are also included.

Starting with the Tenth Edition version, I set about to modernize
the code and get it to compile and run on a modern-day system. (ANSI style declarations and function headers, modern include files,
use of getopt, and most importantly, correct use of Yacc yyval and
yylval variables.)

You will need Berkely Yacc installed as byacc in order to build it.

I have only touch-tested it, but so far it seems OK.=C2=A0 'm= ake' runs in like 2
seconds, really quick. On my Ubuntu Linux systems, it compiles with
no warnings.

I hope to eventually add a test suite also, if I can steal some time.

Before anyone asks, no, I don't think anybody today has any real use
for it.=C2=A0 This was simply "for fun", and because Ra= tfor has a soft
spot in my heart.=C2=A0 "Software Tools" was, for me, t= he most influential
programming book that I ever read.=C2=A0 I don't think there&= #39;s a better
book to convey the "zen" of Unix.

Thanks,

Arnold
--000000000000a1c3e105d223491c--