From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FROM,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 10794 invoked from network); 2 May 2022 23:44:29 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 2 May 2022 23:44:29 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 2CCD89D497; Tue, 3 May 2022 09:44:25 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7BCA89CE23; Tue, 3 May 2022 09:44:03 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b="jVCuyU7h"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 48CE29D431; Tue, 3 May 2022 07:18:09 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-oi1-f179.google.com (mail-oi1-f179.google.com [209.85.167.179]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AE4F29CE23 for ; Tue, 3 May 2022 07:18:08 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-oi1-f179.google.com with SMTP id r1so16265573oie.4 for ; Mon, 02 May 2022 14:18:08 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=3yyMCebEQT6uF0coyLoHhD+o0cqKOP5IV7hloBorXn8=; b=jVCuyU7h5QzOisHUKvAe+OiUorlUVOXpZ88kZxNH7f5u1GEP+iHnbAX4zB/D/4hOnd i2T6WB0WURse4BfZ1fqm4tvLE7Hlj+37eZXbgmqZJjjRAK9+B8VtBLgKMUtT0hx9XWfR TeSv4b7aFvL1b2BG9/hrUgSRfdSu8qSvK1POsI4nLh6wcbtu09nFiFuscX+Wtc9QtmKQ QNe5H8mHhaLFSebMlLXpl9az3lsss6Tzm0mvfns/U155vyapgOZ/XTpMIznkjhtC8ExT 9uvd2sBp/ciaJsLuJpiE+KYSfWiQ3ApTB1e1wp+QEHUIemebsu+OYhyZCxnbAu3WuF31 jUIA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=3yyMCebEQT6uF0coyLoHhD+o0cqKOP5IV7hloBorXn8=; b=76j37FcQQBnvAkkhnhj3PAtBLscM4hVfMxV+3f9utYb5L7ueefb1nDNwHFgM2cCrs2 qpg/il37K4+UeuHzf1thiUoSzew5sfKQJvlAzPPvlXYhPuCaoivCFT5NYzNeRi8ccKxY sMn1Tw+l1jVmFL2ogYr5aagL/M8WNeO+8fSwy7PiuKtZuvRHayn2k7BFiXxrnz0owbN8 VOYqFLoVNtlVKRWOQuFYalqbw0rfpqsjtaG4Jg8mMMu2UvIpl4uDK58Gx+P4MZoVOPfQ pQtVXSqRqJZNBRDlhMTLa2hFiprzBXQ7/7pRaHOgjHXPDfwglmgz6ljoGgtNmVPZh1mw 8dnA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM53160YBzJWFpGohDpqpIta6MnCm7n8gEv6majdH0/QnH6gMArxSK qabiCGqWT5a7pVvIZ0yaJOkE/BJ0qAaP9lxMbs0uyl19PHQ= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJz4VPH17GvTsv7F+x+ATxPYoOQ3LnQirb3Y5qWNj4QZydC7Evv2ixFRAJCvQfyET/MOCjraVo+kHc65QTskyN8= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:23d3:b0:325:d962:ae1f with SMTP id bq19-20020a05680823d300b00325d962ae1fmr503663oib.278.1651526287903; Mon, 02 May 2022 14:18:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <57977CE7-DDCC-4861-BBD2-843B9B9F51C2@ronnatalie.com> <202205020242.2422g30m074857@ultimate.com> In-Reply-To: From: Dan Cross Date: Mon, 2 May 2022 21:17:57 +0000 Message-ID: To: Miod Vallat Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ba516d05de0ded82" Subject: Re: [TUHS] First Unix-like OSes not derived from AT&T code? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --000000000000ba516d05de0ded82 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Mon, May 2, 2022, 2:16 PM Miod Vallat wrote: > > The RT 4.3 port was called AOS (for the, "Academic Operating System"). It > > was mostly Tahoe with NFS and came with most of the sources, but some > bits > > were distributed only as object code: I believe some of the MM bits? > > Perhaps the MMU code? I vaguely recall this being one of the things > people > > had a hard time with when trying to port Reno and 4.4 to the RT. > > What was delivered as binary was the Advanced Floating-Point Accelerator > microcode. Thanks. My memory of all of this is decaying over time. I'd forgotten about the AFPA; I believe our RTs either had a 68881 or 68882, but it's been so long the details are fuzzy: I definitely remember a Motorola FPU, but no longer remember the model. At the end of the AOS work circa 1996, most of the kernel was 4.4, > except for the network stack which was 4.3-Reno, and the VM system which > was still 4.3 (hence no mmap). This happened outside of IBM, didn't it? What prevented the rest of the VM code being ported? > The port was fairly faithful; the C compiler was a bit strange "High C" or > > "Hi C", bit GCC was available after a while, but had some bug and could > not > > compile the kernel. > > The compiler was Metaware High C. GCC could not be used to compile the > kernel sources unchanged, because one of the locore->trap.c paths was > relying upon the stack layout used by the compiler. With that fixed, gcc > could be used to build a working kernel. > I vaguely remember that happening, but by then we had retired the RTs. I vaguely remember Metaware being somewhat religiously extreme, but again the details are fuzzy now. Was there some kind of ecclesiastical reference in the man page? - Dan C. --000000000000ba516d05de0ded82 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Mon, May 2, 2022, 2:16 PM Miod Vallat <miod@online.fr>= ; wrote:
> The RT 4.3 port was c= alled AOS (for the, "Academic Operating System"). It
> was mostly Tahoe with NFS and came with most of the sources, but some = bits
> were distributed only as object code: I believe some of the MM bits? > Perhaps the MMU code? I vaguely recall this being one of the things pe= ople
> had a hard time with when trying to port Reno and 4.4 to the RT.

What was delivered as binary was the Advanced Floating-Point Accelerator microcode.

Thanks. My memory of all of this is decaying over time. I'd forgo= tten about the AFPA; I believe our RTs either had a 68881 or 68882, but it&= #39;s been so long the details are fuzzy: I definitely remember a Motorola = FPU, but no longer remember the model.

At the end of the AOS work circa 1996, most of the kernel was 4.4,
except for the network stack which was 4.3-Reno, and the VM system which was still 4.3 (hence no mmap).
This happened outside of IBM, didn't it? What= prevented the rest of the VM code being ported?
> The port was fairly faithful; the C compiler was a bit strange "H= igh C" or
> "Hi C", bit GCC was available after a while, but had some bu= g and could not
> compile the kernel.

The compiler was Metaware High C. GCC could not be used to compile the
kernel sources unchanged, because one of the locore->trap.c paths was relying upon the stack layout used by the compiler. With that fixed, gcc could be used to build a working kernel.

I vaguely remember that happening, = but by then we had retired the RTs.

I vaguely remember Metaware being somewhat religiously extreme,= but again the details are fuzzy now. Was there some kind of ecclesiastical= reference in the man page?

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - Dan C.

<= div dir=3D"auto">
--000000000000ba516d05de0ded82--