[TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[ron minnich]

the discussion of why the CSRG disbanded in 1995 has come up elsewhere.

My memory is that the reason was pretty simple: DARPA ended their
funding at that time.

Hoping for corrections to my memory :-)

Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[Clem Cole]

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On Tue, Feb 1, 2022 at 10:03 PM ron minnich <rminnich@gmail.com> wrote:

> the discussion of why the CSRG disbanded in 1995 has come up elsewhere.
>
> My memory is that the reason was pretty simple: DARPA ended their
> funding at that time.
>
> Hoping for corrections to my memory :-)
>
That’s pretty much it although they did have some alternative funds and
equipment grants that helped keep them going.  How long it could have been
sustained without ARPA is not known.  There was pressure inside of UCB to
shut it down. --
Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual

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Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[Jon Forrest]

Although not directly related to CSRG, there's an interesting
piece of Unix history at Berkeley recounted in

http://ucbvax.berkeley.edu/passing-of-ucbvax.txt

I was there.

Jon

Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[Erik E. Fair]

	Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2022 20:18:11 -0800
	From: Jon Forrest <nobozo@gmail.com>
	Subject: Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

	Although not directly related to CSRG, there's an interesting
	piece of Unix history at Berkeley recounted in

	http://ucbvax.berkeley.edu/passing-of-ucbvax.txt

	I was there.

	Jon


As was I.

	Erik

Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[ron minnich]

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I should have asked the other question: when did DARPA funding start?

On Tue, Feb 1, 2022, 8:31 PM Erik E. Fair <fair-tuhs@netbsd.org> wrote:

>
>         Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2022 20:18:11 -0800
>         From: Jon Forrest <nobozo@gmail.com>
>         Subject: Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley
>
>         Although not directly related to CSRG, there's an interesting
>         piece of Unix history at Berkeley recounted in
>
>         http://ucbvax.berkeley.edu/passing-of-ucbvax.txt
>
>         I was there.
>
>         Jon
>
>
> As was I.
>
>         Erik
>

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Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[Dan Cross]

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On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 12:31 AM ron minnich <rminnich@gmail.com> wrote:

> I should have asked the other question: when did DARPA funding start?
>

Salus's "25 Years of Unix" book covers this, and I was surprised to find it
available here:
https://wiki.tuhs.org/lib/exe/fetch.php?media=publications:qcu.pdf

Pages 159-160 or so talks about this: it says the DARPA money appeared in
1980?

        - Dan C.

On Tue, Feb 1, 2022, 8:31 PM Erik E. Fair <fair-tuhs@netbsd.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>         Date: Tue, 1 Feb 2022 20:18:11 -0800
>>         From: Jon Forrest <nobozo@gmail.com>
>>         Subject: Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley
>>
>>         Although not directly related to CSRG, there's an interesting
>>         piece of Unix history at Berkeley recounted in
>>
>>         http://ucbvax.berkeley.edu/passing-of-ucbvax.txt
>>
>>         I was there.
>>
>>         Jon
>>
>>
>> As was I.
>>
>>         Erik
>>
>

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Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[Clem Cole]

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On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 12:31 AM ron minnich <rminnich@gmail.com> wrote:

> I should have asked the other question: when did DARPA funding start?
>
Sort of hard to count properly.  DARA funded more than just CSRG.    The
first DARPA money associated with large address work was in 1980 for the
Vax version of Maxima, although there might have been some other projects
before that.  But the CSRG project had not (yet) started when I arrived in
Fall of '81, although the Stanford bake-off had and 4.1BSD was on the
street - as Joy had done the FASTVAX work earlier than spring/summer.  At
that point there were two 780s for CS in Evan Halls (Ernie and Kim). The
'Vaxima' port was working and I believe that the first Franz-LISP release
was out.  FWIW:  The CAD group had just gotten its first in Cory which was
funded by the DEC/HP/IBM and some of the Si manufacturers.  I believe that
Ingress was still an 11/70, but I would defer to Eric on that - I'm not
sure who/what was their funding source, although they had the original
ARPAnet connection via a VDHI to LBL, so DARPA must have been involved.
The C30 IMP (for CSRG) did not arrive in Evans until at least mid 82, I
think maybe '83.

So by 1981/82 the question of how UNIX (as a system) was going to be
supported for the ARPA contractors had become a ripe concern.  It must have
been proposed by then and being negotiated.    IIRC Prof Fabrey was
officially the PI for what would become CSRG, but some one like Eric or
Mary Ann who was already there before me might have more information on the
politics

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Re: [TUHS] CSRG at berkeley

[ron minnich]

that's still an amazing run for DARPA funding. I suppose that aligns
with the reign of Steve Squires.

On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 7:28 AM Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 2, 2022 at 12:31 AM ron minnich <rminnich@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I should have asked the other question: when did DARPA funding start?
>
> Sort of hard to count properly.  DARA funded more than just CSRG.    The first DARPA money associated with large address work was in 1980 for the Vax version of Maxima, although there might have been some other projects before that.  But the CSRG project had not (yet) started when I arrived in Fall of '81, although the Stanford bake-off had and 4.1BSD was on the street - as Joy had done the FASTVAX work earlier than spring/summer.  At that point there were two 780s for CS in Evan Halls (Ernie and Kim). The 'Vaxima' port was working and I believe that the first Franz-LISP release was out.  FWIW:  The CAD group had just gotten its first in Cory which was funded by the DEC/HP/IBM and some of the Si manufacturers.  I believe that Ingress was still an 11/70, but I would defer to Eric on that - I'm not sure who/what was their funding source, although they had the original ARPAnet connection via a VDHI to LBL, so DARPA must have been involved.   The C30 IMP (for CSRG) did not arrive in Evans until at least mid 82, I think maybe '83.
>
> So by 1981/82 the question of how UNIX (as a system) was going to be supported for the ARPA contractors had become a ripe concern.  It must have been proposed by then and being negotiated.    IIRC Prof Fabrey was officially the PI for what would become CSRG, but some one like Eric or Mary Ann who was already there before me might have more information on the politics