From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [50.116.15.146]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEDB823223 for ; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 14:07:43 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 489E643DD5; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 22:07:39 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-lj1-x235.google.com (mail-lj1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::235]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DB7BB43DD4 for ; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 22:07:33 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-lj1-x235.google.com with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ec1620a956so93195561fa.1 for ; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 05:07:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1719490051; x=1720094851; darn=tuhs.org; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date :message-id:reply-to; bh=uBi0WSG0bU2Sjcj+4DxjG+g1N+nW8Y0YPmhGH/R+DDk=; b=ClwmcH8eMLN/6VeRmAey/emv+NB6cCvcQfSQAd5yvdPoRYTeDSH8GYnkFJc5mSHBZf gvxHpYitN6MixgBxUdB8EOyulGSm6Uuoesgb3B5j1Je+M1V0uGavBMJqKaBRdp9QM2mR b6AAjNrrp2pDPDbR1juPGVWxYuqHiGRvYsX1pYl6BunoRbkDjwwcZfXkp9Ro2gY2k+MH ZqZhI7KJRfuwKmwSsugEZhlyOlooqTZG9yv49kM8YPvSEcgg19pb04TMjBC6PzMcBr1P o0yyebE8hGzpJy1nnArll+3gFOSd6805SIYES5wapv6E5atp4eaIblU5i46GuLN+1wbx I5Rg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1719490051; x=1720094851; h=content-transfer-encoding:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from :in-reply-to:references:mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=uBi0WSG0bU2Sjcj+4DxjG+g1N+nW8Y0YPmhGH/R+DDk=; b=UToiP+xUkKbcW16cusRl+KeaFME4We9uL9je9pYtG93HD5RxDGlWWSIGxtEjRyPEPE HBORe4ldPPyce1yOSivbOAo62kITAFZ88ZfalDXVPp3eUsJpKr4PpbGrtQbmG6BlK3VR hL/3DeLqmrV3sAxHzHztlOFxhhAYoGMUFzl1+n5cpUycFOogiToq0az+N74OXkrDdr0P Q8BjMqh/S8BF6Nyx0AzNf8RHgeeEz6aYS5pg/h9zWkgbJu+9y8w7rpCyBjasvJMgpzS5 I8acJW166Uw+M5o38m3v3G/tW63vQxXNfVYL6+r7td7H3pQKoXdx2lhEK5ks4p5ztPkT +/rw== X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCWeYlFBj3FbKlSCMR3cBPf3JiH0t9m1sExATp0DnLJy817Btk+vjGnxFfI4TjEI7svTQwOJxHgyUaCwl3Hq X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YyYhQMQhUvtVdpLPPM+0hPsLO0eHgSKvU0Nc6opngev+FG2lb6I y+pUxlFJLYBgnPSqmNSiF2wLJF9toqt1+zYJ+m3zCogPf1bGiKa14r32H8kpFZvnwNAye4QMLPn sKdyrIAkd965sJwhaG5Ai6fcJ+LBNewLz X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IFvvsKfcfIwVnMYkD1klSFTO4fRQneQ5dpAabDO0sjndUrpq0I54sMMx4QJ0o9YuYZl4L9beo0y+JyXqunI6n0= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:9811:0:b0:2ec:5019:8fa5 with SMTP id 38308e7fff4ca-2ec5b388425mr74566511fa.40.1719490051039; Thu, 27 Jun 2024 05:07:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <55B612BA-0805-4357-8736-8CEED8F3791A@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <55B612BA-0805-4357-8736-8CEED8F3791A@gmail.com> From: Dan Cross Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2024 08:06:54 -0400 Message-ID: To: Peter Yardley Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID-Hash: PJV5PBLCWDFLB6GBZK26MXAC5KJJ5AF3 X-Message-ID-Hash: PJV5PBLCWDFLB6GBZK26MXAC5KJJ5AF3 X-MailFrom: crossd@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: another OSX 100% less Unix List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Thu, Jun 27, 2024 at 8:02=E2=80=AFAM Peter Yardley wrote: > OSX is Mach which has a BSD emulation layer. And BSD injected into the ke= rnel. > > It doesn=E2=80=99t claim to be UNIX. Not true! It does: macOS is actually certified and registered as Unix. It's my understanding that Apple paid a fair bit of money to make that happen: https://www.opengroup.org/openbrand/register/ - Dan C. > > On 27 Jun 2024, at 1:29=E2=80=AFPM, ron minnich wr= ote: > > > > I have a directory, t: > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ ls -li > > total 0 > > 23801442 -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 a > > 23801443 -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 b > > 23801443 -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 c > > > > note that b and c are the same inode. > > > > let's make a cpio. > > > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ cpio -o >../t.cpio > > a > > b > > c > > ^D > > 1 block > > > > what's in it? > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ cpio -ivt < ../t.cpio > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 a > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 b > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 c link to b > > > > "c link to b"? wtf? Who thought that was a good idea? because ... > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ touch 'c link to b' > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ ls -l > > total 0 > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 a > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 b > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 c > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:22 c link to b > > > > and > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ cpio -o >../t.cpio > > a > > b > > c > > c link to b > > ^D > > > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ cpio -ivt < ../t.cpio > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 a > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 b > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 c link to b > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:22 c link to b > > > > so ... it looks like a file is there twice, because somebody thought it= was a good idea to confuse a file name and file metadata. And, anyway, it'= s just as accurate to have it say > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 a > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 b link to c > > -rw-r--r-- 2 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:21 c link to b > > -rw-r--r-- 1 rminnich wheel 0 Jun 26 20:22 c link to b > > Right? :-) > > > > From the same people who brought you this: > > ronsexcllentmbp:t rminnich$ bc > > >>> > > > > Somebody needs to get the osx folks a unix manual set :-) > > Peter Yardley > peter.martin.yardley@gmail.com >