From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FROM,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 24052 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2021 12:50:12 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 4 Jul 2021 12:50:12 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 87BD79C9AB; Sun, 4 Jul 2021 22:50:09 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 095B79C873; Sun, 4 Jul 2021 22:49:06 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=gmail.com header.i=@gmail.com header.b="Z51QIn01"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id E95799C873; Sun, 4 Jul 2021 22:49:01 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-oi1-f169.google.com (mail-oi1-f169.google.com [209.85.167.169]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 564289C871 for ; Sun, 4 Jul 2021 22:49:00 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-oi1-f169.google.com with SMTP id t80so17582941oie.8 for ; Sun, 04 Jul 2021 05:49:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=QRZwazrhyAh8lGps1owcaIb/YD3PDmkiU2SAMg7SqAY=; b=Z51QIn01KZndaCkuRr1xWHSCRrlL0dojHUJ0Ju9FZjbgnd+sz2wuL4FtW477OEfJdj rZAlIyvzM5nuOOvwRMGX/mWn7wDXev7DoU+zEXvziGwEAW7a4iondXOxzGheyjSu4Hak ASyfH2wQh77b01jHpZ/k2gZLHBMBXXmu8A6bdQfr7W+WzXofySoy7jWD+QhR8aZYSM3F Y+F86UxOYuczr8WgWiPdujZlL3fI2pyVWeT1YBzVCOE8PzLGD4z58J8U/EOYh2OYKaEa PtpfLaarNCnKg7Y+uMl2UwZSY9HXP89N7SY9Y9flx/QbaOS82+PK8QNtAGmF6OwLax6C vPFg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=QRZwazrhyAh8lGps1owcaIb/YD3PDmkiU2SAMg7SqAY=; b=TWtNahcJFeHHLe8Jk6xOXiNZGU2369APzSWKTmn3NiV7k6BoESKhEAXBoDU/ummbah eT+kld5ZT7pkfHIgtn865Z4Q1uuzKWSk4Pk/Z6/vjvIW0QJJUYOcrJk22H0euekTTK01 0W94zlb/g3UWx+lxRsQblQtbeuPNQYtjO5ydhXO5yFQF3Tx7T7vALiNvUAnz1PhIws0Z gBVZjgnYYqaN+5KJZc/Pxk6wTxedA1RBff4vZesDPsgUZZWUWHljDxwGC/6S9jaBAwzA wQ129zpy2BwH3+KKFl8C74Po/wqWBMQ5KK0ONpu4F9Htnd3nDf9NRt2SmkDd70/JuV8O Ynzg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530vGRX6j/+8DG9Vg47kFG8w44e/0QfFTaagAk4/qcYOYCpXkVaV r61aApuqLij/mxzTEV2umZc9Qx1ichDRLQ+XqOk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw5SQ7Vu21x4r/ape7QZH0RAf0R3OBbia10mtrjEFNcLcC7O+OIpLYGsgcsdjUMK1G+zkTkB6ynDtv1KY/vUbI= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6808:209e:: with SMTP id s30mr6859035oiw.110.1625402939489; Sun, 04 Jul 2021 05:48:59 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20210702213648.GW817@mcvoy.com> <396911b232bae5938068a14fe0f7181e@firemail.de> <20210704004757.GB24671@tau1.ceti.pl> In-Reply-To: <20210704004757.GB24671@tau1.ceti.pl> From: Dan Cross Date: Sun, 4 Jul 2021 08:48:23 -0400 Message-ID: To: Tomasz Rola Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d3416305c64b9c7d" Subject: Re: [TUHS] [tuhs] The Unix shell: a 50-year view X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: TUHS main list Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --000000000000d3416305c64b9c7d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Sat, Jul 3, 2021 at 8:57 PM Tomasz Rola wrote: > On Sat, Jul 03, 2021 at 09:20:57AM -0400, Dan Cross wrote: > [...] > > Much of Unix's early evolution and thus architecture and philosophy, came > > from addressing a set of problems that people had in a historical context > > that, one could argue, aren't that relevant anymore. > > I mostly agree with you, but I think certain things should be > expressed more explicitly, even if I do not want to be picky. So, I > see the claim of Unix not being relevant anymore might be interpreted > in two ways, and both are not (quite) true. I didn't say that Unix is no longer relevant. I said that the problems that were prominent when Unix was built, and that thus shaped its architecture, are much _less_ relevant now than they were at the time. They still have some relevance, but are no longer primary for the vast majority of use cases Unix is used for. Further, the way people approach problems now has changed, even if they still generically assume "Unix" as the base they build on. - Dan C. --000000000000d3416305c64b9c7d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Sat, Jul 3, 2021 at 8:57 PM Tomasz Rol= a <rtomek@ceti.pl> wrote:
On Sat, Jul 03, 2021 at 09:20:57AM -0400, Dan Cross wrote:
[...]
> Much of Unix's early evolution and thus architecture and philosoph= y, came
> from addressing a set of problems that people had in a historical cont= ext
> that, one could argue, aren't that relevant anymore.

I mostly agree with you, but I think certain things should be
expressed more explicitly, even if I do not want to be picky. So, I
see the claim of Unix not being relevant anymore might be interpreted
in two ways, and both are not (quite) true.

I didn't say that Unix is no longer relevant. I said that the problems= that were prominent when Unix was built, and that thus shaped its architec= ture, are much _less_ relevant now than they were at the time. They still h= ave some relevance, but are no longer primary for the vast majority of use = cases Unix is used for. Further, the way people approach problems now has c= hanged,=C2=A0even if they still generically assume "Unix" as the = base they build on.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - = Dan C.

--000000000000d3416305c64b9c7d--