From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id a18021c0 for ; Wed, 6 Feb 2019 23:40:54 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 9B3649B8A3; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 09:40:53 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DC839B8A2; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 09:40:39 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="key not found in DNS" (0-bit key; unprotected) header.d=kev009.com header.i=@kev009.com header.b="FFmsUWpg"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 95A0F9B8A2; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 09:40:37 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-it1-f180.google.com (mail-it1-f180.google.com [209.85.166.180]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 288A89B8A1 for ; Thu, 7 Feb 2019 09:40:37 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-it1-f180.google.com with SMTP id m62so10356836ith.5 for ; Wed, 06 Feb 2019 15:40:37 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=kev009.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=p1DrFA1HFq/XfnY2+824ezEVOyGNcVubX5ik7xQoxF0=; b=FFmsUWpgW0KS3hLLyWM5P6PfjtPi5tTPNA1pwADg7/NuNbs3rSRghRXRHlZEramRs5 HL9Y/xspmvbxUVjluPhb0ED0jvkWMw1KXPjRexMiwFevedhCTJBnmlSoM2TtijNlNvHL vIo+vEl+OO/mSTc8LiVcU9Gbh6c3GUAqqYF6Y= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=p1DrFA1HFq/XfnY2+824ezEVOyGNcVubX5ik7xQoxF0=; b=l730JRi7YU71vpbev5wrkelsfpTS3gQvU+Axbsa7GugU1DSqsgLuSwwNg5YzRzUmG2 zMyucS5RzMSo7GGD3KpSx8uOlrH8RJ28kDD60LmS8LSYajqYBjXpFuHSvhWgNM10JU+F LYRTZGRpFQE/qpbjAL9xHLon5UzWC4FKq5wl8YMPc7+ClmzJpNTOx895RrI26QAuLDgv Cnww8hyVX/quryIQiCNChGdT5O0Bs9JdMJyCPwIXODYNf9Q2Az98/VNPQEXpoNS+mJNW SCuR3ZWI2ttjW9RHBsyhALTSSy+trxRNzOerOQh29vr0igCHisurXLx1vUS7jZe6Aulk h8xg== X-Gm-Message-State: AHQUAua8b0QKQX7MnzJ2oHinX/QKBdSvBEa7fIXoxTxNlidScv8S/Sxb KU/cNkadGe5/69n0UzMIdklrW0afuyQxFI+WYYAhEXb2iOk= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AHgI3IZyqR+anEqFXjUBwsd31jcHECxETCyRu7ohRCZWHKouczhadupV7115uSQ/xmLGRTIkQYSmrvbsc+RMKlzlz+I= X-Received: by 2002:a02:844:: with SMTP id 65mr7147686jac.133.1549496436422; Wed, 06 Feb 2019 15:40:36 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20190206231852.5B33018C07B@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: <20190206231852.5B33018C07B@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> From: Kevin Bowling Date: Wed, 6 Feb 2019 16:40:24 -0700 Message-ID: To: Noel Chiappa Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [TUHS] OSI stack (Was: Posters) X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" Seems like a case of winners write the history books. There were corporate and public access networks long before TCP was set in stone as a dominant protocol. Most F500 were interchanging on SNA into the 1990s. And access networks like Tymnet, etc to talk to others. TCP, coupled with the rise of UNIX and the free wheel sharing of BSD code, are what made the people to talk to. On Wed, Feb 6, 2019 at 4:19 PM Noel Chiappa wrote: > > > From: Kevin Bowling > > > I think TCP was a success because of BSD/UNIX rather than its own > > merits. > > Nope. The principle reason for TCP/IP's success was that it got there first, > and established a user community first. That advantage then fed back, to > increase the lead. > > Communication protocols aren't like editors/OS's/yadda-yadda. E.g. I use > Epsilon - but the fact that few others do isn't a problem/issue for me. On the > other hand, if I designed, implemented and personally adopted the world's best > communication protocol... so what? There'd be nobody to talk to. > > That's just _one_ of the ways that communication systems are fundamentally > different from other information systems. > > Noel