From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIMWL_WL_MED,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 0bc6da5a for ; Tue, 20 Nov 2018 00:56:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id DFC7C94BB2; Tue, 20 Nov 2018 10:56:43 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F669945F5; Tue, 20 Nov 2018 10:56:09 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id E2564940FA; Tue, 20 Nov 2018 10:56:00 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-wm1-f48.google.com (mail-wm1-f48.google.com [209.85.128.48]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 42667940F8 for ; Tue, 20 Nov 2018 10:55:55 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-wm1-f48.google.com with SMTP id 125so510892wmh.0 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2018 16:55:55 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=Wx9GUgQ43G6KPZQj35GY2jo9qedpTYfb2Q2vMCpdkwQ=; b=n+axLLc8gYDDaFR/QlJhwqQxIbuPoSxzL6DReKUr6uADNE2BraBA2to+j9HVdTjy3E fc/fBMphiwNC/NvuTgMuH3E/Em39aXsyM2W8ABGDACuL69Miq6SaR7F8Yn2uNq57RseX hb5R7J4XwEBZCFdxglUWnGbC8zBd6mWUCbDPnGtx6pEWi9jjE5jSR5b2H+ZFm1Gpgq/W kE3go8F1GqJRsVFSHNCivCNJNoLOFpn+05sJ9KpeurUH1lErgtLQkTY4Cmg/FMkhs1UY GQRUEixE2GuNmvd3qBj7aXn+GmHjBtgfSwq1Q6nZM9bf1o3JfYQHCqgSMkYXaO8GJPa0 7nnA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Wx9GUgQ43G6KPZQj35GY2jo9qedpTYfb2Q2vMCpdkwQ=; b=GVLOv5D9yZKjUFhXnQRyllitlAZ/EgN37/wKXWWUZ+3sZbv4ueKCFgasbzlOZGJ4My I6kfzfD+f3T/TvGrIQDRNsPT/TqZPiQAUHxcs80UqrdOaFsVaOfo50LLHYzDaORrEySw Qm2WWkj810lg7gY0vNgZp3KfDGeef5zdPZf9aXoiB//im4ADF3NMmuFU84XaCsoDnwGE jf1d9jINf7u2EdklLipeH6akGxjbEBwpJDZoFyv+ugJ4KE5AE80hxntUv2MpI460s32J +FdFkbu3JU6JHVmpP1l6tW5Emdg9kstzq43jqNC7oicdPsPhTQea0zVj8wTJ9tq23Ny2 BhFw== X-Gm-Message-State: AGRZ1gLAs9pPg2k+IwFXn7EmIqtOaLJtCBz6gE/bLaqJ+M7/zRhG7bk4 6d9j+wGrYHY5rrQSiB6H4WAAYR7Zv9eSeR2/55cQsQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AJdET5eNwA4ho78FjWnVIDhnirO2joOh0NvdqA6piyDAEtLO2PCQ+OuFv8qqAZ8lkUGhxJhE/kcbCPhQCMXUBlAWzaI= X-Received: by 2002:a1c:c10b:: with SMTP id r11mr257612wmf.84.1542675353514; Mon, 19 Nov 2018 16:55:53 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20181117153919.6468B18C073@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> <3c7cb03bb23814934ba4ce5735e28b85@bl.org> In-Reply-To: <3c7cb03bb23814934ba4ce5735e28b85@bl.org> From: George Michaelson Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2018 10:55:41 +1000 Message-ID: To: mparson@bl.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [TUHS] man-page style X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" The infection vector feels to me to be X10->X11 -> Xorg. When X became the ubiquitous desktop system in UNIX, it was bringing with it the MIT key bindings for editing text inside panes in X applications (clients). This was by default the Emacs bindings. The default (pre Bash) shell on BSD, and hence Solaris, was BSD derived csh. Thus tcsh which had by default emacs bindings. Ksh required more licence hoops, in some cases you had to buy it. I . am unsure if its default was vi mode, but the net impact was: if you ran any desktop system on the main arc of purchase in a university or near relationship, you ran Dec Ultrix (X11) or OSF/1 (X11) or SunOS (X11, after their initial foray into their own) or Unisys/Motorola terminals on a cray (X10/X11) or Humingbird X client on a WIndows PC (X11) or a tectronix X terminal (X11) or an NCD x terminal (X11) We got to default edit in the Mosaic for the URL browser bar, by way of X11 clients: look at that ma: it inherited the MIT emacs key bindings. X was the virus. Emacs key bindings went viral. On Tue, Nov 20, 2018 at 8:19 AM Michael Parson wrote: > > > On 2018-11-18 22:15, Dave Horsfall wrote: > > On Sun, 18 Nov 2018, Chet Ramey wrote: > > > >> It's not clear how widespread this is, but on my Mac OS X system, > >> emacs key bindings are pervasive. TextEdit, text controls in apps and > >> browsers, pretty much everything understands the basic emacs > >> keybinding. > > > > As a Mac user I never noticed that, but I'll admit to using EMACS key > > bindings in the various shells, despite being a VI user... A bit like > > using CSH at the terminal, but never for scripting :-) > > I first learned about shell shortcuts from an emacs user, and I briefly > considered picking up emacs... Then I found out I could enable vi > keybinding in my shell and squashed that impulse. :) > > The only emacs keybindings I still use in the shell are ^R for searching > my history, ^W for deleting words, and occasional use of ^K for killing > text to EOL. Other than ^R, I swap between the vi and emacs bindings > for those others, just depending on where my cursor is on the line. > > -- > Michael Parson > Pflugerville, TX > KF5LGQ