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* [TUHS] UNIX on (not quite bare) System/370
@ 2022-12-19 17:38 Phil Budne
  2022-12-19 18:53 ` [TUHS] " segaloco via TUHS
                   ` (4 more replies)
  0 siblings, 5 replies; 42+ messages in thread
From: Phil Budne @ 2022-12-19 17:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

The October 1984 BSTJ article by Felton, Miller and Milner
https://www.bell-labs.com/usr/dmr/www/otherports/ibm.pdf

Describes an AT&T port of UNIX to System/370 using TSS/370
underpinnings as the "Resident System Supervisor" and used as the 5ESS
switching system development environment.

I also found mention at http://www.columbia.edu/~rh120/ch106.x09
chapter 9 of http://www.columbia.edu/~rh120/ with footnote 96:

      Ian Johnstone, who had been the tutor at University of New
      South Wales working with Professor John Lions, was one of the
      researchers invited to Bell Labs. He managed the completion at
      AT&T Bell Labs of the port of Unix to the IBM 370 computer. See
      "Unix on Big Iron" by Ian Johnstone and Steve Rosenthal, UNIX
      Review, October, 1984, p. 26. Johnstone also led the group that did
      the port to the AT&T 2B20A multiprocessor system.

I found
https://ia902801.us.archive.org/3/items/Unix_Review_1984_Oct.pdf/Unix_Review_1984_Oct.pdf
"BIG UNIX: The Whys and Wherefores" (pdf p.24), which only offers rationale.

Also:

	"IBM's own involvement in Unix can be dated to 1979, when it
	assisted Bell Labs in doing its own Unix port to the 370 (to
	be used as a build host for the 5ESS switch's software). In
	the process, IBM made modifications to the TSS/370 hypervisor
	to better support Unix.[12]"
at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_AIX#cite_ref-att-s370-unix_12-0

Is there any other surviving documentation about the system?
Any recall of what branch of AT&T UNIX it was based on?

Thanks!
Phil


^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 42+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] Re: UNIX on (not quite bare) System/370
@ 2022-12-20 22:25 Noel Chiappa
  2022-12-20 23:18 ` Bakul Shah
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 42+ messages in thread
From: Noel Chiappa @ 2022-12-20 22:25 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs; +Cc: jnc

    > From: Bakul Shah

    > Is there a publicly available description of Reiser's VM system?  I
    > found "A Unix operating system for the DEC VAX 11/780 Computer" by
    > London & Reiser which includes a long paragraph on VM (included below)

That para is basically all about the VAX paging hardware; it doesn't say
anything about how that (any :-) Unix actually uses it.

	 Noel

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 42+ messages in thread
* [TUHS] Re: UNIX on (not quite bare) System/370
@ 2022-12-22 17:26 Noel Chiappa
  2022-12-22 17:33 ` Dan Cross
  2022-12-22 20:25 ` Warner Losh
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 42+ messages in thread
From: Noel Chiappa @ 2022-12-22 17:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs; +Cc: jnc

    > From: Bakul Shah

    > There is a further para:

    >  Reducing external memory fragmentation to zero by utilizing the VAX-
    >  11/780 memory mapping hardware for scatter loading is high on the list
    >  of things to do in the second implementation pass.

I'm curious as to exactly what is meant by "external memory"? They must mean
memory on the Synchronous Backplane Interconnect:

  http://gunkies.org/wiki/Synchronous_Backplane_Interconnect

I.e. what most of us would call 'main memory'.

If this code didn't even allocate main memory by pages, instead of in
process-size blocks, it sounds like it's much like 32V (or is it 32V that's
being discussed; I thought this thread had moved on to the Reiser demand
paging version - my apologies it I've gotten lost).


Also, this note:

  http://gunkies.org/wiki/Talk:CB-UNIX

from Dale DeJager (which he kindly gave me permission to post) gives a fair
amount of detail on the relationship between the Research and CB/UNIX
versions, with a brief mention of USG - precisely the era, and relationships,
that are so poorly documented. Interestingly, he indicates that the early
versions of what later became CB/UNIX used something in the V1/V3 range (V4
was the first one in C), so it dates back earlier than most people apparently
assume.

If anyone else has any first-hand notes (i.e.from people who were there at the
time), about the relationship between all the early systems, for which the
author has given permiosssion to post it, please send it to me and I will
add it to the appropriate article on the CHWiki.

Probably the most needed is more about the roots of USG; Dale has filled in
CB/UNIX, and the roots of PWB are covered fairly well in the BSTJ article
on it:

  https://archive.org/details/bstj57-6-2177

at least, for PWB1. Anything that covers the later PWBs would likewise be
gratefully receied.


I suppose I should also write up the relationships of the later UNIXen - 32V
and its descendants too - any material sent to me about them will be most
gratefully received. (If anyone want a CHWiki account, to write it up
themselves, please let me know).

   Noel

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 42+ messages in thread

end of thread, other threads:[~2022-12-23  1:55 UTC | newest]

Thread overview: 42+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
-- links below jump to the message on this page --
2022-12-19 17:38 [TUHS] UNIX on (not quite bare) System/370 Phil Budne
2022-12-19 18:53 ` [TUHS] " segaloco via TUHS
2022-12-19 21:01   ` Clem Cole
2022-12-19 21:19     ` Rob Pike
2022-12-19 22:15       ` segaloco via TUHS
2022-12-20  0:02         ` Brad Spencer
2022-12-20  1:04           ` Adam Thornton
2022-12-20  2:35             ` segaloco via TUHS
2022-12-20 14:25           ` Andrew Hume
2022-12-19 23:02       ` Clem Cole
2022-12-20  1:20         ` Larry Stewart
2022-12-20  1:33           ` Larry McVoy
2022-12-20  1:57             ` George Michaelson
2022-12-20  2:06               ` Dan Cross
2022-12-20 15:04                 ` Chet Ramey
2022-12-20  2:12               ` Adam Thornton
2022-12-20 15:29                 ` Andy Kosela
2022-12-20 15:35                   ` Adam Thornton
2022-12-21  2:43                     ` Luther Johnson
2022-12-20 23:18                 ` David Arnold
2022-12-20  2:52       ` Bakul Shah
2022-12-20  3:09         ` Larry McVoy
2022-12-20  3:27           ` Bakul Shah
2022-12-20  3:48           ` Warner Losh
2022-12-20  4:21           ` Jonathan Gray
2022-12-19 21:36 ` Marc Donner
2022-12-19 22:52   ` Charles H Sauer (he/him)
     [not found]   ` <01428a75-3507-7b8a-fd35-cef74c8c0bd2@ucsb.edu>
2022-12-20  1:49     ` [TUHS] Re: pre-1991 USENIX proceedings Marc Donner
2022-12-20  3:11 ` [TUHS] Re: UNIX on (not quite bare) System/370 Warner Losh
2022-12-20  8:56 ` arnold
2022-12-20  9:31   ` segaloco via TUHS
2022-12-20  9:39     ` arnold
2022-12-20  9:55       ` Jonathan Gray
2022-12-20 14:27     ` Clem Cole
2022-12-23  1:53       ` Rob Gingell
2022-12-22 19:00 ` Andrew Hume
2022-12-20 22:25 Noel Chiappa
2022-12-20 23:18 ` Bakul Shah
2022-12-22 17:26 Noel Chiappa
2022-12-22 17:33 ` Dan Cross
2022-12-22 20:25 ` Warner Losh
2022-12-22 23:06   ` Warner Losh

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