From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,MISSING_HEADERS,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 27548 invoked from network); 5 Jul 2021 04:24:40 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 5 Jul 2021 04:24:40 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 26D7D9CA51; Mon, 5 Jul 2021 14:24:37 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D5A49C9F1; Mon, 5 Jul 2021 14:23:54 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=pass (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.i=@algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.b="f/RE5W21"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id D291B9C9F1; Mon, 5 Jul 2021 14:23:51 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-lj1-f182.google.com (mail-lj1-f182.google.com [209.85.208.182]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7AA1A9C9F0 for ; Mon, 5 Jul 2021 14:23:50 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-lj1-f182.google.com with SMTP id a6so22839276ljq.3 for ; Sun, 04 Jul 2021 21:23:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=algebras-org.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:cc; bh=Pdgu5+AbERtk4BLsO+hOvN2A8J7dr0ztiB53ttoh5VE=; b=f/RE5W21i+EPIr4lvTBINE2gGE2nmXZxbGbau7IoXjafnzuZy0EgJ6M1OqNps7yzMi 4+veGU6c2Hv1s7a3lJ9LikfqsYaH8TvNm3S3l98w0aITIZ8u2Z9sjXESSWWT7kubylIr P2FDOkes1Y7xw4yC/u/aTDJrz3aqa4x5XUquhlN3zP7axiaHE3CPOC9ivm5jPMkT0jDS vKFR0DvoAEfC+rmM82qB7fseqr53ha3+j9VI2OoC9mFMXDZWKmnLy3dlF/AzjkKvR4/a D7GxIyz6TM/IwPdXE/hqHZSDv/KKvF1g1FnLfqNZNqzg2Eo6xst1IwJjaC2pWlIN23Vr Ovag== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:cc; bh=Pdgu5+AbERtk4BLsO+hOvN2A8J7dr0ztiB53ttoh5VE=; b=S9nx9C2rvAyeJ4Kzj5KIVwUu9WiNfNhJe6NJ3zEFX7kvEl0MTOwlLlZoekLKl9Ufef fnUfqGrx1jtMDQosaWD8SwrRpzPs4GBqwRmEDLXmEBSqVRQisFoFZQD78Xg//QcwoPgb ezsAq/GlGUL4Fj8RX9ROOUncQ5Tm+kgLG6Z8vYL90+azFo+252D95EwqfbRQHnW4kpYj chRIWdnYGMtHigqNYrgOzXRBN5b3hr9bk+FZOnNdl7yiAyxgQTPGGswF9RplDU5LpksB xduJH0GzxJAJcvyWHvWAxTIMPOl7x0PbD90+K10sO22+cvrqzzPtyPs9hLHr0yWWuwJD oGMQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530CMbqo5CGV1W8vBkee182UEAFTEGEyke6chNieuCgPiioDgbH5 tZO4/5fgOtcBdpObge0NKdrW49wqg5B4ohyN5ew1Pjeacuc= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzHSfbHppY+q/ZQadM9N8mIOF+DmT/3n0tbyS7dxA6yonWkKSWsDUjb6OW5jesuYeckSKL1ka+CLRi6rZRPQQc= X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:b20:: with SMTP id b32mr9622552ljr.288.1625459028266; Sun, 04 Jul 2021 21:23:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20210702213648.GW817@mcvoy.com> In-Reply-To: From: George Michaelson Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2021 14:23:36 +1000 Message-ID: Cc: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Subject: Re: [TUHS] Is C obsolete? (was Re: [tuhs] The Unix shell: a 50-year view) X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" Forgive me a side note, but has it not been shown for some time that apart from a very gifted few people, hand-crafted machine-code is usually slower than the best optimising compilers these days? With out of order instruction stuff, side effects (inter-core locking) cache coherency &c it isn't hard to wind up using "simpler" machine code which performs worserer. Doesn't really alter the language debate, but it does go to "compilers are pretty smart these days"