From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FROM,HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 10923 invoked from network); 9 Mar 2023 20:48:53 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (2600:3c01:e000:146::1) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 9 Mar 2023 20:48:53 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05AAB412A1; Fri, 10 Mar 2023 06:48:49 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-vs1-xe34.google.com (mail-vs1-xe34.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e34]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 87E214129B for ; Fri, 10 Mar 2023 06:48:38 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-vs1-xe34.google.com with SMTP id m10so2836556vso.4 for ; Thu, 09 Mar 2023 12:48:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; t=1678394917; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=NbSCkUnAkOrXrP0SxiKf83xTF7LTXhuRpETCz9chzVE=; b=Nu96xHPv1uZJUHw4JH0ogl6FBrT7aBvb4NGprMb+zvkmdoHxF3zWzxReGRIbSzd+Uj /0CEQf0bl4MB84B7XTRxCL1dR0ycMGEAqjAKEG3k9Q/jgHi2KZyMRLShf3kKlASX2An/ OEP0mQUgaifgC392jD30tAcPjPRAB05Ti/7QM0k8MLT8fypUvIpLNDSFqsVUmSrrvBSB WJ8h9QdG6YOI89HF/IPsX3ytKQNnbVBDsmVFahwsuGUm8UjFWqrzQ9YUQJqvX+CbdJUc bHDAZJfxpbwBWR5F0p6PAhfmirUc6prIasdIXkdKp3RxXNjLoaS4MAGWWAqHcKo1IAYs mRbw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; t=1678394917; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=NbSCkUnAkOrXrP0SxiKf83xTF7LTXhuRpETCz9chzVE=; b=mYZCJ8dltDYOJuTxiAWqBSmWcwY0OWh7pNi+j3MQ8nd8qtJfCdMvqzQ5bFlw+xdG0s fRCVFmE8T9go47GtRcZJtr8l8lTfWFXqgxR4tqVAOzlw3XAX6l8Pb1RwDA/yLKCsqla6 0SgEYqk6VKI+ggSiOnmvIrifIVetG3PJEZIICySygE2Cb/AwIMFlkvEeYGr20yzImS1j c001o7DJRGOpw2T/6XgqKlGvbngyyjPnF+LKkJYy0SaimMw/shAh7Ty8yw/NwDbPB8N9 Gz2kRDXpGm+qRy/AfINVRm1IehftdbD6z4yOC1hexF2KFH8JK8+gTaNFPJavgY1GAoWe g4LA== X-Gm-Message-State: AO0yUKVibwTnvAd2mvABw53R8kmH6VGYxqTDJnBX5+PSe8vB+/SGFSqm 6PTfbUBQ2WncQ7624xQdvWH1cneYPnoHAqudcqM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: AK7set97/MuYBuNWsFfaGPpusT1YulCQ0vAiBcjZ2PrxrQ8w3MSWS6CE/1r3YTPL4xWmRNGbtTV2ga3/Fwinr8dRjWg= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6102:82a:b0:422:1641:e0b0 with SMTP id k10-20020a056102082a00b004221641e0b0mr4917150vsb.6.1678394917131; Thu, 09 Mar 2023 12:48:37 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <944F23E0-DBB0-45E3-AE08-3CF17AE98426@pobox.com> In-Reply-To: From: Rob Pike Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2023 07:48:26 +1100 Message-ID: To: Clem Cole Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d41b2605f67dc4ec" Message-ID-Hash: 7WXSKE2GIJSHIEIUDYWEATNOKUDBZAXT X-Message-ID-Hash: 7WXSKE2GIJSHIEIUDYWEATNOKUDBZAXT X-MailFrom: robpike@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: segaloco via TUHS X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Fifth Edition Manual Restoration List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000d41b2605f67dc4ec Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I had an idea. I asked Tom Duff, Mike Tilson, Bill Reeves to help me put together tools and font digitizations to "print" nroff output to the Versatec plotter one weekend in early 1978. Ron Baecker, their adviser, came in Monday morning furious that they had been hacking instead of working on their thesis. When he saw what we were doing, his tone changed completely and he asked if he could use it to send out a grant application he was working on. I used it for my 4th year optics thesis, which caused my prof to say I had obviously plagiarized it from somewhere, because there was otherwise no way to produce something that looked like that (Xeroxed Versatec paper). I had to work hard to convince him I had not cheated. Later that year we, mostly Bill, coupled it to troff, along with some digitized fonts, and it went out on the Toronto tapes, with our names on it. For many years I saw evidence in scientific papers of people using Bill's digitization of the Bodoni fonts. This is where it gets interesting. Berkeley took it, tweaked it some - improved it yes, but it was substantially our code - and shipped it out, with our names removed and "Copyright the Regents of the University of California" across the top. I was seriously pissed but there was really nothing I could do about it. Years later I finally asked Joy about it, and his unapologetic answer was their lawyers didn't want our names on their software so they dropped them. When Dennis Ritchie and Greg Chesson - together, yikes - were interviewing me for my job at Bell Labs, Dennis, holding my resume, asked why I had had worked on Versatec support for nroff and troff when Berkeley had already done it. I believe the force of my reply helped convince them I was worth hiring. Years later, bless him, Henry Spencer said something on Usenet explaining why the "Berkeley typesetting software" was missing the names of those who created it. He was in the lab that weekend and saw it happen. -rob On Fri, Mar 10, 2023 at 1:25=E2=80=AFAM Clem Cole wrote: > As far as I know, Tom Ferrin wrote the original in the late 1970s - it is > on the original UCSF tape as part of his UNIX graphics tools. That said= , > Joy may have passed it along on the BSD tapes also. It's called "vcat" an= d > converts Wang C/A/T codes to plotter strokes on a smaller (11/12in wide > IIRC) Varian (originally) and small Versatec [wet / kerosene style] plott= er > using the 200 bpi Hershey fonts that the CMU/MIT/Stanford XGP had used. > IIRC, UCB had a large format Versatec (36"/48") and the UCB version coul= d > do N pages at a time. In the Adobe 'transcript' package is a similar > program (based on Tom work) but outputs using Adobe Fonts. > > It might take some searching "foo" to find them, but Tom's program is wha= t > most of us used back in the day before the Imagen and later Apple > LaserWriter - particularly after having had access to an XGP or a Xerox > Dover in college ;-) > =E1=90=A7 > > On Wed, Mar 8, 2023 at 6:10=E2=80=AFPM David Arnold wr= ote: > >> > On 9 Mar 2023, at 03:30, Angelo Papenhoff wrote: >> >> =E2=80=A6 >> >> > And even then one would need CAT emulation, which I >> > haven't bothered with yet. >> >> That sounds like a fun project =E2=80=94 is there really no such beast a= lready? >> >> >> >> >> d >> >> --000000000000d41b2605f67dc4ec Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I had an idea. I asked Tom Duff, Mike Tilson, Bill Reeves to help= me put together tools and font digitizations to "print" nroff ou= tput to the Versatec plotter one weekend in early 1978. Ron Baecker, their = adviser, came in Monday morning furious that they had been hacking instead = of working on their thesis. When he saw what we were doing, his tone change= d completely and he asked if he could use it to send out a grant applicatio= n he was working on. I used it for my 4th year optics thesis, which caused = my prof to say I had obviously plagiarized it from somewhere, because there= was otherwise no way to produce something that looked like that (Xeroxed V= ersatec paper). I had to work hard to convince him I had not cheated.
=

Late= r that year we, mostly Bill, coupled it to troff, along with some digitized= fonts, and it went out on the Toronto tapes, with our names on it. For man= y years I saw evidence in scientific papers of people using Bill's digi= tization of the Bodoni fonts.

This is where it gets interesting.

<= div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif">Berkeley= took it, tweaked it some - improved it yes, but it was substantially our c= ode - and shipped it out, with our names removed and "Copyright the Re= gents of the University of California" across the top. I was seriously= pissed but there was really nothing I could do about it. Years later I fin= ally asked Joy about it, and his unapologetic answer was their lawyers didn= 't want our names on their software so they dropped them.

When Dennis = Ritchie and Greg Chesson - together, yikes - were interviewing me for my jo= b at Bell Labs, Dennis, holding my resume, asked why I had had worked on Ve= rsatec support for nroff and troff when Berkeley had already done it. I bel= ieve the force of my reply helped convince them I was worth hiring.

Years = later, bless him, Henry Spencer said something on Usenet explaining why the= "Berkeley typesetting software" was missing the names of those w= ho created it. He was in the lab that weekend and saw it happen.

-rob


On Fri, Mar 10, 2023 at 1:25=E2=80=AFAM Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote:
As far as I know, Tom Ferr= in wrote the original in the late 1970s - it is on the original UCSF tape a= s part of his UNIX graphics tools.=C2=A0 =C2=A0That said, Joy may have pass= ed it along on the BSD tapes also.=C2=A0It's called "vcat" an= d converts Wang C/A/T codes to plotter strokes on a smaller (11/12in wide I= IRC) Varian (originally) and small Versatec [wet / kerosene style] plotter = using=C2=A0the 200 bpi Hershey fonts that the CMU/MIT/Stanford XGP had used= .=C2=A0 =C2=A0IIRC, UCB had a large format Versatec (36"/48") and= the UCB version could do N pages at a time.=C2=A0 =C2=A0In the Adobe '= transcript' package is a similar program (based on Tom work) but output= s using Adobe Fonts.=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0

It might take = some searching=C2=A0"foo" to find them, but Tom's program is = what most of us used back in the day before the Imagen and later Apple Lase= rWriter - particularly after having had access to an XGP or a Xerox Dover i= n college ;-)
3D""<= font color=3D"#ffffff" size=3D"1">=E1=90=A7

On Wed, Mar 8, 2023 at 6:= 10=E2=80=AFPM David Arnold <davida@pobox.com> wrote:
> On 9 Mar 2023, at 03:30, Angelo Papenhoff = <aap@papnet.eu>= ; wrote:

=E2=80=A6

> And even then one would need CAT emulation, which I
> haven't bothered with yet.

That sounds like a fun project =E2=80=94 is there really no such beast alre= ady?




d

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