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From: Marc Donner <marc.donner@gmail.com>
To: Vincenzo Nicosia <katolaz@freaknet.org>
Cc: TUHS <tuhs@tuhs.org>
Subject: [TUHS] Re: Anyone ever heard of teaching a case study of Initial Unix?
Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2024 11:35:50 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <CALQ0xCA-7GqGhPYGdn1MPLVGVPc1AessoUbzS_55qpW39R8nFA@mail.gmail.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <ZoVq3tsEbh/H9ghC@wontolla.jungle>

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There have been case study courses here and there over the years.  I would
argue that Lyons’s book of sources was the text for one.  An old crony, Ed
Smith, used to teach a comparative programming languages course back in the
day.  And I know someone at NYU taught a course where people studied the
source code of a variety of utilities.

=====
nygeek.net
mindthegapdialogs.com/home <https://www.mindthegapdialogs.com/home>


On Wed, Jul 3, 2024 at 11:27 AM Vincenzo Nicosia <katolaz@freaknet.org>
wrote:

> On Wed, Jul 03, 2024 at 02:51:01PM +1000, sjenkin@canb.auug.org.au wrote:
> > I???ve never heard of a Computer Science or Software Engineering program
> > that included a ???case study??? component, especially for Software
> Development & Projects.
> >
> > MBA programs feature an emphasis on real-world ???case studies???, to
> learn from successes & failures,
> > to give students the possibility of not falling into the same traps.
> >
> > Creating Unix V6, because it profoundly changed computing & development,
> > would seem an obvious Case Study for many aspects of Software, Coding
> and Projects.
> >
>
> I personally believe that the comparison of "mainstream" software
> development principles and the birth and development of projects like
> Unix, Linux, or any other major successful free software project is
> fundamentally flawed.
>
> The programmers considered as "fungible workforce" by mainstream
> software engineering and project management theories are *paid* to to
> their programming job, and they mostly have to carry that job over
> working on prescribed objectives and timelines which have been decided
> by somebody else, managers who know nothing at all about software
> development. Personal interest in the project, passion, motivation,
> curiosity, creative power, sense of beauty, the joy of belonging to a
> community of likeminded people, are never part of the equation, at any
> point.
>
> Remove one of those latter ingredients from Unix, Linux, or any other
> major successful free/open source software project, and that project
> would have not existed, at all.
>
> I think it would be terribly misleading to teach young CS students that
> software projects should be managed "as Unix v6 came to life". They will
> never, ever find anything even close to that environment in a
> professional workplace. We should tell them that some of the most
> beautiful software projects ever crafted by humans did not come out of
> the "professionalism churches" that the overwhelming majority of
> software companies are nowadays, based on  the blind application of
> "mainstream" software development and project management principles,
> according to which they (the CS majors) are just "as fungible and
> replaceable as a chair, or a wallpaper". That would be only true and
> fair to tell them.
>
> I don't know if that would be of any avail to them, but at least we do
> not mislead them in thinking that their paid programming time will
> actually change the world in any meaningful way.....
>
> My2cents
>
> Enzo Nicosia
>
> --
>

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  reply	other threads:[~2024-07-03 15:36 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 84+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2024-07-03  4:51 [TUHS] " sjenkin
2024-07-03  5:02 ` [TUHS] " Al Kossow
2024-07-03  6:46   ` arnold
2024-07-03 14:04   ` Clem Cole
2024-07-03 15:22     ` Theodore Ts'o
2024-07-03 15:36       ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-03 14:59   ` Marc Rochkind
2024-07-03 23:35     ` G. Branden Robinson
2024-07-04 13:00       ` Marc Donner
2024-07-03  9:04 ` A. P. Garcia
2024-07-03 15:17 ` Vincenzo Nicosia
2024-07-03 15:35   ` Marc Donner [this message]
2024-07-03 17:39     ` Jon Forrest
2024-07-03 17:49       ` segaloco via TUHS
2024-07-03 18:16         ` Erik E. Fair
2024-07-03 19:58         ` Rich Salz
2024-07-03 23:15     ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-03 23:23       ` Marc Donner
2024-07-03 23:26       ` Rik Farrow
2024-07-04 23:26         ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-03 15:37   ` Al Kossow
2024-07-03 16:01     ` Al Kossow
2024-07-03 16:05       ` Warner Losh
2024-07-03 23:29   ` Marc Rochkind
2024-07-03 23:50     ` G. Branden Robinson
2024-07-04  8:23     ` Vincenzo Nicosia
2024-07-04 20:34       ` Nevin Liber
2024-07-04 20:44         ` segaloco via TUHS
2024-07-04 21:41           ` sjenkin
     [not found]             ` <7AC009E5-C985-44AD-A55E-E0BFC05CDD31@serissa.com>
2024-07-05  9:41               ` Steve Jenkin
2024-07-05  9:47               ` Steve Jenkin
2024-07-05  0:03         ` Stuff Received
2024-07-05  0:12           ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-05  2:24             ` Adam Thornton
2024-07-05  2:42               ` Bakul Shah via TUHS
2024-07-05  7:13                 ` arnold
2024-07-05  7:42                   ` Bakul Shah via TUHS
2024-07-05  8:20                     ` arnold
2024-07-05  8:52                       ` G. Branden Robinson
2024-07-05  7:36               ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-05 10:18                 ` Peter Yardley
2024-07-05 21:38                   ` [TUHS] Re: mental architecture models, " John Levine
2024-07-05 21:49                     ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-05 22:08                       ` Charles H Sauer (he/him)
2024-07-05 22:24                         ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-05 23:17                       ` John Levine
2024-07-06 12:52                         ` sjenkin
2024-07-06 14:02                           ` John R Levine
2024-07-06 15:58                           ` Clem Cole
2024-07-06 20:56                             ` John R Levine
2024-07-06 21:32                               ` Charles H Sauer (he/him)
2024-07-06 23:46                                 ` Peter Yardley
2024-07-07 17:43                                   ` James Frew
2024-07-07  1:39                                 ` John Levine
2024-07-07  3:26                                   ` [TUHS] Re: PL.8 [was " Charles H Sauer (he/him)
2024-07-07  5:33                         ` [TUHS] " arnold
2024-07-05 22:10                     ` Dan Cross
2024-07-07 22:00                   ` [TUHS] " Dave Horsfall
2024-07-07 23:28                     ` Brad Spencer
2024-07-08  6:17                       ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-08  6:27                       ` Lars Brinkhoff
2024-07-08  6:51                         ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-08  9:36                           ` David Arnold
2024-07-08  6:59                       ` arnold
2024-07-08 13:22                         ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-08 15:37                           ` Al Kossow
2024-07-08 17:22                             ` Tom Lyon
2024-07-08 17:04                           ` Clem Cole
2024-07-08 15:28                         ` Brad Spencer
2024-07-08 15:33                           ` Al Kossow
2024-07-08  0:21                     ` John Levine
2024-07-08  0:35                       ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-08 12:29                     ` Peter Yardley
2024-07-05 16:40                 ` Jon Steinhart
2024-07-06 13:20                   ` Dave Horsfall
2024-07-05  0:08       ` Marc Rochkind
2024-07-04  1:53 ` John Levine
2024-07-04  2:59   ` segaloco via TUHS
2024-07-04  6:53     ` Rob Pike
2024-07-04 15:07       ` Larry McVoy
2024-07-03 14:46 [TUHS] " Norman Wilson
2024-07-03 15:45 ` [TUHS] " Clem Cole
2024-07-03 15:52   ` Clem Cole
2024-07-03 16:12   ` Chet Ramey via TUHS
2024-07-05 13:20 Douglas McIlroy

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