Never mind. I see John Cowan has already asked. I'll crawl back in my hole now On Sat, Jul 4, 2020, 1:10 AM Paul Palmer Could someone point me to some information about s editor? > > Googling didn't help > > On Fri, Jul 3, 2020, 9:00 PM >> Send TUHS mailing list submissions to >> tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> tuhs-request@minnie.tuhs.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> tuhs-owner@minnie.tuhs.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of TUHS digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. v7 uucp debugging help requested (Adam Thornton) >> 2. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (Clem Cole) >> 3. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (Grant Taylor) >> 4. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (John Cowan) >> 5. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (Clem Cole) >> 6. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (Clem Cole) >> 7. Re: v7 uucp debugging help requested (Norman Wilson) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 13:52:42 -0700 >> From: Adam Thornton >> To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society >> Subject: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: >> > g@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> (if this is better suited for COFF, that'd be fine too) >> >> I've been trying to set up UUCP on my V7 system and its raspberry Pi host. >> This plus the "s" editor (already working) are really all that's needed to >> make this something pretty close to a daily driver, if all I wanted to do >> was write text files (which in some sense is all my job _is_, but to be >> fair I get a much more immediate feedback loop in my current environment). >> >> I was following >> >> https://github.com/jwbrase/pdp11-tools/blob/master/howtos/V7%20UUCP%20Installation%20Guide.pdf >> more or less--I had already rebuilt v7 with the DZ terminal driver and was >> using it for interactive sessions (albeit, before I started trying to get >> UUCP running, with 7-bit line discipline--but I've since changed that). >> >> I have 16 DZ lines, I've set them to 8-bit mode. They're working fine, >> because I can use them for terminal sessions. >> >> I've built UUCP, set a node name, and set it up on the pi. >> >> I can execute uucico to send files, and it, frustratingly, almost works. >> >> >From the Pi side, I see (with uulog): >> >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:34.97 23106) Calling system v7 (port TCP) >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:42.25 23106) Login successful >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:44.44 23106) Handshake successful (protocol >> 'g' sending packet/window 64/3 receiving 64/7) >> uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:11:51.61 23106) Sending >> /home/adam/git/simh/sim_scsi.h (6780 bytes) >> uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:16:21.79 23106) ERROR: Timed out waiting for >> packet >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Protocol 'g' packets: sent 86, >> resent 6, received 1 >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Errors: header 2, checksum 0, >> order 0, remote rejects 0 >> uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:22.51 23106) Call complete (283 seconds 5440 >> bytes 19 bps) >> >> So it's clearly logging in, and if I telnet in directly, the v7 end is >> starting uucico as expected: >> >> login: pi-uucp >> Password: >> Shere >> >> uulog -x on the v7 side has no output, and nothing ever appears in the >> spool directory, which I suspect is a direct result of the timeout waiting >> for packet. >> >> So my question is, what else do I do to debug this? Clearly the pi >> (Taylor >> UUCP) side is expecting something else--maybe an acknowledgement?--from >> the >> v7 side to let it know the transmission was successful. >> >> Any help would be appreciated. >> >> Adam >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/fbc5f57a/attachment-0001.htm >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 17:26:48 -0400 >> From: Clem Cole >> To: Adam Thornton >> Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: >> < >> CAC20D2Mxug+DdwUcS-FDvWzt4ysmZkZDtVgQ8_HYAz2kpPVS8g@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> On Fri, Jul 3, 2020 at 4:54 PM Adam Thornton wrote: >> >> > (if this is better suited for COFF, that'd be fine too) >> > >> > I've been trying to set up UUCP on my V7 system and its raspberry Pi >> > host. This plus the "s" editor (already working) are really all that's >> > needed to make this something pretty close to a daily driver, if all I >> > wanted to do was write text files (which in some sense is all my job >> _is_, >> > but to be fair I get a much more immediate feedback loop in my current >> > environment). >> > >> > I was following >> > >> https://github.com/jwbrase/pdp11-tools/blob/master/howtos/V7%20UUCP%20Installation%20Guide.pdf >> > more or less--I had already rebuilt v7 with the DZ terminal driver and >> was >> > using it for interactive sessions (albeit, before I started trying to >> get >> > UUCP running, with 7-bit line discipline--but I've since changed that). >> > >> > I have 16 DZ lines, I've set them to 8-bit mode. They're working fine, >> > because I can use them for terminal sessions. >> > >> As a long time UUCP person on PDP-11's, "Danger Will Robinson." >> >> Just for grins and giggles on the V7/PDP-11 side, try it over a DH (VH >> driver in simh) emulation (or even a KL/DL - although the >> simulated interrupts will be a mother). That said, the VH driver is a not >> exactly a DH as I understand it, its the later QBUS version which was >> similar but different. It's been on my list of things I want to chase >> down at some point to make work to get it closer to the original. >> >> FYI: Running UUCP over real DZ's was always troublesome. There were a ton >> of updates/patches done post the original V7 release in the DZ drivers to >> make them play better. Most of us that ran large UUCP set up in the old >> days, installed ABLE DMAX (DH/DM) that were a single board DH replacement >> - >> they are DMA, and buffered (and supported proper modem control which the >> DZ's don't - although later UCB work on the driver sort of faked it enough >> to make to it work for basic dial-up use reasonably reliably). >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/093ff539/attachment-0001.htm >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 3 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 16:38:31 -0600 >> From: Grant Taylor >> To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: <01f8f896-9921-6c55-8dc2-6b9859f2f230@tnetconsulting.net> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" >> >> On 7/3/20 2:52 PM, Adam Thornton wrote: >> > I've built UUCP, set a node name, and set it up on the pi. >> > >> > I can execute uucico to send files, and it, frustratingly, almost works. >> >> Which system are you referring to here? The Pi or V7? >> >> > From the Pi side, I see (with uulog): >> > >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:34.97 23106) Calling system v7 (port TCP) >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:42.25 23106) Login successful >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:44.44 23106) Handshake successful >> > (protocol 'g' sending packet/window 64/3 receiving 64/7) >> > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:11:51.61 23106) Sending >> > /home/adam/git/simh/sim_scsi.h (6780 bytes) >> > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:16:21.79 23106) ERROR: Timed out waiting >> > for packet >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Protocol 'g' packets: sent >> > 86, resent 6, received 1 >> >> I'm a little surprised that you're trying to use the 'g' protocol to >> talk to v7. I thought the 'g' protocol came out later for TCP over >> Ethernet connections. As such I wonder if UUCP on v7 supports the 'g' >> protocol. >> >> I think that Clem knows a LOT more about this than I do. >> >> I'm ignorantly asking questions. >> >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Errors: header 2, checksum >> 0, >> > order 0, remote rejects 0 >> > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:22.51 23106) Call complete (283 seconds >> > 5440 bytes 19 bps) >> > >> > So it's clearly logging in, and if I telnet in directly, the v7 end is >> > starting uucico as expected: >> > >> > login: pi-uucp >> > Password: >> > Shere >> >> Shouldn't that be something more like the following? >> >> Shere=v7 >> >> What does 'uuname -l' (or '--local') show? (I'm much more familiar with >> Taylor UUCP than I am the UUCP in v7. >> >> > uulog -x on the v7 side has no output, and nothing ever appears in the >> > spool directory, which I suspect is a direct result of the timeout >> > waiting for packet. >> > >> > So my question is, what else do I do to debug this? Clearly the pi >> > (Taylor UUCP) side is expecting something else--maybe an >> > acknowledgement?--from the v7 side to let it know the transmission was >> > successful. >> > >> > Any help would be appreciated. >> >> I've not messed with this particular problem in probably 2 years and >> I've forgotten more than comments above. >> >> >> >> -- >> Grant. . . . >> unix || die >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: smime.p7s >> Type: application/pkcs7-signature >> Size: 4013 bytes >> Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/b827f997/attachment-0001.bin >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 4 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 18:50:24 -0400 >> From: John Cowan >> To: Adam Thornton >> Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: >> > DzyQnUZg@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> On Fri, Jul 3, 2020 at 4:54 PM Adam Thornton wrote: >> >> >> > I've been trying to set up UUCP on my V7 system and its raspberry Pi >> > host. This plus the "s" editor (already working) >> > >> >> What is this "s" editor? The v7 man pages say nothing about it, and of >> course Dr. Google is equally unhelpful. >> >> >> John Cowan http://vrici.lojban.org/~cowan cowan@ccil.org >> We call nothing profound that is not wittily expressed. >> --Northrop Frye (improved) >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/83879cf0/attachment-0001.htm >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 5 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 20:28:49 -0400 >> From: Clem Cole >> To: Grant Taylor >> Cc: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: >> > ze2pdY5wRJnYbiYFxb-GcXK1P7SbZJFoPg@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Grant - The g (greg’s protocol) is correct. IIRC that’s the only line >> protocol Dan distributed in the V7 original code base. >> >> On Fri, Jul 3, 2020 at 6:46 PM Grant Taylor via TUHS < >> tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> >> wrote: >> >> > On 7/3/20 2:52 PM, Adam Thornton wrote: >> > > I've built UUCP, set a node name, and set it up on the pi. >> > > >> > > I can execute uucico to send files, and it, frustratingly, almost >> works. >> > >> > Which system are you referring to here? The Pi or V7? >> > >> > > From the Pi side, I see (with uulog): >> > > >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:34.97 23106) Calling system v7 (port >> TCP) >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:42.25 23106) Login successful >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:44.44 23106) Handshake successful >> > > (protocol 'g' sending packet/window 64/3 receiving 64/7) >> > > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:11:51.61 23106) Sending >> > > /home/adam/git/simh/sim_scsi.h (6780 bytes) >> > > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:16:21.79 23106) ERROR: Timed out waiting >> > > for packet >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Protocol 'g' packets: sent >> > > 86, resent 6, received 1 >> > >> > I'm a little surprised that you're trying to use the 'g' protocol to >> > talk to v7. I thought the 'g' protocol came out later for TCP over >> > Ethernet connections. As such I wonder if UUCP on v7 supports the 'g' >> > protocol. >> > >> > I think that Clem knows a LOT more about this than I do. >> > >> > I'm ignorantly asking questions. >> > >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Errors: header 2, checksum >> 0, >> > > order 0, remote rejects 0 >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:22.51 23106) Call complete (283 seconds >> > > 5440 bytes 19 bps) >> > > >> > > So it's clearly logging in, and if I telnet in directly, the v7 end is >> > > starting uucico as expected: >> > > >> > > login: pi-uucp >> > > Password: >> > > Shere >> > >> > Shouldn't that be something more like the following? >> > >> > Shere=v7 >> > >> > What does 'uuname -l' (or '--local') show? (I'm much more familiar with >> > Taylor UUCP than I am the UUCP in v7. >> > >> > > uulog -x on the v7 side has no output, and nothing ever appears in the >> > > spool directory, which I suspect is a direct result of the timeout >> > > waiting for packet. >> > > >> > > So my question is, what else do I do to debug this? Clearly the pi >> > > (Taylor UUCP) side is expecting something else--maybe an >> > > acknowledgement?--from the v7 side to let it know the transmission was >> > > successful. >> > > >> > > Any help would be appreciated. >> > >> > I've not messed with this particular problem in probably 2 years and >> > I've forgotten more than comments above. >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Grant. . . . >> > unix || die >> > >> > -- >> Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/3340357a/attachment-0001.htm >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 6 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 20:31:05 -0400 >> From: Clem Cole >> To: Grant Taylor >> Cc: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: >> < >> CAC20D2Mt4t+Y4hqeDusB1rxw_CdzJsFySJnEcr2g1T6vUgDHbw@mail.gmail.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Grant. I wrote e for Ethernet based ( ip/ tcp ) connections at Masscomp so >> we didn’t have hack the mailer at time. >> >> On Fri, Jul 3, 2020 at 6:46 PM Grant Taylor via TUHS < >> tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> >> wrote: >> >> > On 7/3/20 2:52 PM, Adam Thornton wrote: >> > > I've built UUCP, set a node name, and set it up on the pi. >> > > >> > > I can execute uucico to send files, and it, frustratingly, almost >> works. >> > >> > Which system are you referring to here? The Pi or V7? >> > >> > > From the Pi side, I see (with uulog): >> > > >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:34.97 23106) Calling system v7 (port >> TCP) >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:42.25 23106) Login successful >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:11:44.44 23106) Handshake successful >> > > (protocol 'g' sending packet/window 64/3 receiving 64/7) >> > > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:11:51.61 23106) Sending >> > > /home/adam/git/simh/sim_scsi.h (6780 bytes) >> > > uucico v7 adam (2020-07-03 08:16:21.79 23106) ERROR: Timed out waiting >> > > for packet >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Protocol 'g' packets: sent >> > > 86, resent 6, received 1 >> > >> > I'm a little surprised that you're trying to use the 'g' protocol to >> > talk to v7. I thought the 'g' protocol came out later for TCP over >> > Ethernet connections. As such I wonder if UUCP on v7 supports the 'g' >> > protocol. >> > >> > I think that Clem knows a LOT more about this than I do. >> > >> > I'm ignorantly asking questions. >> > >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:21.80 23106) Errors: header 2, checksum >> 0, >> > > order 0, remote rejects 0 >> > > uucico v7 - (2020-07-03 08:16:22.51 23106) Call complete (283 seconds >> > > 5440 bytes 19 bps) >> > > >> > > So it's clearly logging in, and if I telnet in directly, the v7 end is >> > > starting uucico as expected: >> > > >> > > login: pi-uucp >> > > Password: >> > > Shere >> > >> > Shouldn't that be something more like the following? >> > >> > Shere=v7 >> > >> > What does 'uuname -l' (or '--local') show? (I'm much more familiar with >> > Taylor UUCP than I am the UUCP in v7. >> > >> > > uulog -x on the v7 side has no output, and nothing ever appears in the >> > > spool directory, which I suspect is a direct result of the timeout >> > > waiting for packet. >> > > >> > > So my question is, what else do I do to debug this? Clearly the pi >> > > (Taylor UUCP) side is expecting something else--maybe an >> > > acknowledgement?--from the v7 side to let it know the transmission was >> > > successful. >> > > >> > > Any help would be appreciated. >> > >> > I've not messed with this particular problem in probably 2 years and >> > I've forgotten more than comments above. >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Grant. . . . >> > unix || die >> > >> > -- >> Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> http://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/attachments/20200703/eeebfeff/attachment-0001.htm >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 7 >> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2020 20:35:52 -0400 (EDT) >> From: norman@oclsc.org (Norman Wilson) >> To: tuhs@tuhs.org >> Subject: Re: [TUHS] v7 uucp debugging help requested >> Message-ID: <20200704003552.EB5914422E@lignose.oclsc.org> >> >> Grant Taylor: >> >> I'm a little surprised that you're trying to use the 'g' protocol to >> talk to v7. I thought the 'g' protocol came out later for TCP over >> Ethernet connections. As such I wonder if UUCP on v7 supports the 'g' >> protocol. >> >> ===== >> >> You're mis-remembering. g was the original protocol, >> intended for use over possibly-noisy serial lines (e.g. >> modems on POTS). It does error checking of various >> sorts with retransmission. I believe it is named g >> after the protocol's original designer, Greg Chesson. >> >> Later protocols meant to work over reliable, error- >> checked links like a TCP/IP circuit were t and e. >> >> Norman Wilson >> Toronto ON >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Subject: Digest Footer >> >> _______________________________________________ >> TUHS mailing list >> TUHS@minnie.tuhs.org >> https://minnie.tuhs.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/tuhs >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of TUHS Digest, Vol 56, Issue 3 >> *********************************** >> >