From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED, DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED,FREEMAIL_FROM,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 24672 invoked from network); 19 Jan 2023 15:03:46 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 19 Jan 2023 15:03:46 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B66542435; Fri, 20 Jan 2023 01:03:38 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-il1-f177.google.com (mail-il1-f177.google.com [209.85.166.177]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ED8C742431 for ; Fri, 20 Jan 2023 01:03:30 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-il1-f177.google.com with SMTP id o15so1275584ill.11 for ; Thu, 19 Jan 2023 07:03:30 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20210112; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Hzn551WKR1qCwDlR6yMWZdUOEsLIxzwBxVM83gkqIRw=; b=nvy2NMQT5Gh0+3I9Mj3nSfHBBX8hV18Qv94MGrcoj8cUiCdpkkcAF8IvQ1WPTNONZV mIwmKgxYw4fX3yIVxB/ZalCrHaqP0Qgq8uMY6XMvpnkJAS143ttsLdJpPBYum+NYMiob bUEKV1l3jFZuQk3EhVH9N9BPLMUF0UhdhzEBly6yBe4/0gogX6HW8GcrfdkZup9zwJyS uADdeIAW0rUocUKCkTYHcq3+nxhpG4jreYyITm+vUMNcMGSJ9J/HeMU/4TsDDMkwnGoK b6qXxQBSeyJGkmaEQNTZVyM8Cpg4dk+nYeJsJ+9GIIRJEhk3eKlpT3WpUZAyu43DjM7D vZgw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=Hzn551WKR1qCwDlR6yMWZdUOEsLIxzwBxVM83gkqIRw=; b=uuuS9hN5bhWLjwKnBWPWSdUcMsS+6N0y/F7vxvSFaSdquaqJQV2fW9UKf2DZJoKR9t TZLd0QNkl+3yWfo/0XFDWUYv45egc14XY61Qo56TdOhNJXZt2K142ciezE9zVajMsBf5 rLIRiL4q46w8ixvUmGF60+JxlSt4q/uqoMBr9RGrSiMimu9ig/idJO6haahXEqbE9C2l ZINrPDLCyuxLvh6+dpfry9tHx76B/mIhKEYKhUWjcK80VXo+kkRvDKaYpJu/iQFjtM3u 34Suc+No3c94yzqtWqeQRndk3Tp+0QePXmMe84+wTb9wc9uMv84qDDgxLhg28sAtqwvT yr2Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2koqLE7Pr1tdr5IOqcIqyDHg2lsOvuRHt8HwBG7iM5nytRN2gr8D seEr0aj/igJlvbC6pfjLleEOUKHAL5wMEWSaU+eyjpIdadAeuh9b X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXvbUYEU5pkxw2s+MKWMKNCC15FalN6OXmWfO4biQWvoCOgIl5IhUIXTqy7pPx7bUTlyj5xBFzBpzB6poJJG/0w= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6e02:b29:b0:30d:979a:ae21 with SMTP id e9-20020a056e020b2900b0030d979aae21mr1133107ilu.319.1674140550044; Thu, 19 Jan 2023 07:02:30 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202301180943.30I9hrOw030485@freefriends.org> <202301181513.30IFDDUJ015224@freefriends.org> <20230118151446.GD2964@mcvoy.com> <20230118161959.GE2964@mcvoy.com> <2f00f9a6-c57d-8490-4066-931ec6e191cd@gmail.com> <20230118164242.GG2964@mcvoy.com> In-Reply-To: <20230118164242.GG2964@mcvoy.com> From: Liam Proven Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2023 16:02:18 +0100 Message-ID: To: tuhs@tuhs.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Message-ID-Hash: CEYW4YZRZMAEY5T5LRTVSSHDIRQ4TM5H X-Message-ID-Hash: CEYW4YZRZMAEY5T5LRTVSSHDIRQ4TM5H X-MailFrom: lproven@gmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: AIX moved into maintainance mode List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Wed, 18 Jan 2023 at 17:43, Larry McVoy wrote: > Look, Linux users are tiny compared to Windows / MacOS, I think the > desktop users is around 1%. BSD users are even more tiny than Linux. Actually, I think that's not true any more. ChromeBooks outsold Mac in the USA in 2017, and worldwide by 2020. (Sales have fallen off a cliff since the pandemic, but that's because so many people have one and are happy with it, I think.) I think that's in the region of 250-300 million desktop Linux users. Secondly, the PRoC has a "5-3-2 programme" in place to compel all organisations to move to Linux and get rid of American OSes. Last year was the nominal completion when 98% of machines were to have been replaced or reinstalled; the assumption was that there would be at least 2% of Windows boxes that they _couldn't_ readily replace. https://www.theregister.com/2019/12/09/china_orders_ban_on_us_computers_and_software/ I've looked at OpenKylin. It's Ubuntu. Deepin is Debian underneath although they're planning to move away from it. It's hard to get any reliable figures, but frankly, Ubuntu Kylin and Deepin are good, attractive, friendly OSes. They are frankly better and friendlier than GNOME or KDE, IMHO, and they're working on things like dual root partitions with failover, like ChromeOS has. I suspect that there may be another 100 million to maybe 250M users there, too. Which means about half a billion Linux desktops and laptops out there. It's not that Linux on the desktop never happened. It did, from 2017-2020. It's over. It's history. But the Linux world, predictably, didn't notice and doesn't count these as "proper" Linuxes. ChromeOS is a 100% a Linux, based on Gentoo, but it's not aimed at Linux users. It doesn't even have a package manager. And too many of we Westerners don't bother looking at stuff with funny writing from far away, so they don't notice this stuff. I've lost count of how many Ubuntu distro roundups just dismiss Kylin as "the version for China" and don't even try it. (The few that do, like it.) I tried to give an overview: https://www.theregister.com/2022/08/30/kylin_the_multiple_semiofficial_chinese/ If I am right, and I don't have strong evidence, then I suspect that there, ballpark, as many Kylin and Deepin users as ChromeOS users, and that put together, they account for about 90% of Linux users. In other words, the estimates of western distro usage are about 1/10 of the real picture. -- Liam Proven ~ Profile: https://about.me/liamproven Email: lproven@cix.co.uk ~ gMail/gTalk/FB: lproven@gmail.com Twitter/LinkedIn: lproven ~ Skype: liamproven UK: (+44) 7939-087884 ~ Czech [+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal]: (+420) 702-829-053