From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 22103 invoked from network); 4 Jan 2023 00:58:26 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 4 Jan 2023 00:58:26 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9C7D42539; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 10:58:20 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-ej1-f50.google.com (mail-ej1-f50.google.com [209.85.218.50]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D811742538 for ; Wed, 4 Jan 2023 10:58:14 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-ej1-f50.google.com with SMTP id u9so79238010ejo.0 for ; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 16:58:14 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=1oyspiyn0j5XV9EfDmS18BHVo0iXVzMEuC+2GxUHr2c=; b=4R5UyDDfZ0MWT4+EDYBhLLRzGkCOJpy85aZluBSpMwlCvfWVZERJtB4MBwbUPTlsS1 aAvCqHrTzhda4dYoTP8NcAWE9E6bYYr1MHZxo2N6hoOgQjXOQhSSc0wX/WQ1+juxvt01 tZrmRL6taPBjnpigaxjOp1QH6r7Lh4owzYFLPH8IoEdwDmn371hHxvyqA8NHNgCXV2oA xzHegQ/o3fCR0m8Iq+uoYXj+HMhYvEZuZUhYt9eG6G5X6fH+mEMXjRacMM/2o86N0IOm CyvyFmagpZEldXdSE6Y/riAR4kBeYjRj3tMHlgs/RJI1rJSXhC4cm8Xn/lSJ1onRdt/S z8Vg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=1oyspiyn0j5XV9EfDmS18BHVo0iXVzMEuC+2GxUHr2c=; b=3n3q8XNKR7tbx9RHccB+gIyQ2FrLIumZvbWlohXMxlBYSn/RFRz3IFsCXtyxg9Ze8E 1SHWal1beYKnzFARiJjfA57EJ+FtYqbqHoyPBXlewww0pQ8uzsm1VmA58ZaFaKR4aUM4 234jKRgJ85pxNeniIjFDBMHM+4JYbY3NjDkplxQIXISFO2vmTVoPrCP3Vl7WSAJBEeG8 GHT4SWxi7Phk0IJzkS/TW5WfDNNaG1AieWgiypV5g2DcmI0Jj6S5h7XlDDeZekfYu9iQ +gmFKubTY/qaRPekNy3McDyADFxOM8aNwhbe4M4NjJy+GrJf0mCvOQj1e1YX8Ra1aBbG 8LDQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AFqh2koCfzyqsDZcQhJa8cTRBdgLoeLKcFA7W9e66IMB0dB/8dUUW92M JuZLDg7ZjwYgFbo1C8SWAapUNSfykXez+QJSXTg35g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AMrXdXvcjA6b9AQy4/tXMsKsn3QfM3vW98jhnr18113q7nrAb0yWSKcL3dtmELA380i+XOPju0hO53CoVeDWoQL0EBs= X-Received: by 2002:a17:906:6d90:b0:7b9:631b:7dfb with SMTP id h16-20020a1709066d9000b007b9631b7dfbmr3260165ejt.32.1672793833229; Tue, 03 Jan 2023 16:57:13 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <371F8C4D-AAAC-4CD9-9547-3A7AC0C961D0@atvetsystems.com> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2023 17:57:02 -0700 Message-ID: To: segaloco Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000366a5c05f165aa57" Message-ID-Hash: LDNI4GG7LSTE5FE33SY4G4NX26CXFJQ3 X-Message-ID-Hash: LDNI4GG7LSTE5FE33SY4G4NX26CXFJQ3 X-MailFrom: wlosh@bsdimp.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: rob@atvetsystems.com, The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: AT&T UNIX PC (7300) Teardown and Restoration List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: --000000000000366a5c05f165aa57 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable https://www.amazon.com/NOYITO-Module-Conversion-Arduino-communicates/dp/B07= BJJ1T5G is my go-to for when I need a simple one, though something like https://www.amazon.com/NOYITO-Module-Conversion-Arduino-communicates/dp/B07= BJJ3TZR might work better for your setup if you just have more of the TTL gear than RS-232 gear (I have way too many old RS-232 cables because I never know when I'll need them again...) Warner On Tue, Jan 3, 2023 at 5:46 PM segaloco wrote: > Nope, unfortunately I only know as much as is needed to plug into the GPI= O > RX/TX/GND working on single boards. I wouldn't be surprised if my > assumption I just run these pins into the D-25 in the right holes is > bunk...but that's how we learn sometimes. Once I move I should be able to > setup a proper work bench where I can tinker on this sort of thing more > intentionally rather than haphazardly. So perhaps a silly question for an > expert but a valid one for me. I'll chase that angle and see if it bears > fruit. > > - Matt G. > ------- Original Message ------- > On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 4:40 PM, Warner Losh > wrote: > > > > On Tue, Jan 3, 2023, 5:30 PM segaloco via TUHS wrote: > >> I'd love to get my hands on a 3B2 someday, this'll be cool if I can get >> it going but that'd be a much more robust machine. >> >> I'm starting to suspect if there isn't any sort of boot ROM that spits >> out commentary on the UART and that doesn't get flexed until UNIX is up,= I >> may not be able to get very far. I referred to >> http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/att/3b1/999-809-010IS_UNIX_PC_Rem= ote_Access_1986.pdf >> for the serial settings and it appears: >> >> 9600 baud, 1 stop bit, no parity, 8 data bits >> >> And the relevant pins >> >> Pin 1 - GND >> Pin 2 - RX >> Pin 3 - TX >> Pin 4 - RTS >> Pin 5 - CTS >> Pin 6 - DSR >> Pin 7 - GND >> Pin 8 - DCD >> Pin 20 - DTR >> >> So I've plugged my USB-TTY GND/RX/TX into the relevant pins and setup th= e >> necessary tty settings. The manual then suggests if running null modem m= ode >> to short pin 4 to 5 and then pins 6, 8, and 20 together, presumably >> omitting any need for modem signalling from the remote machine, doing ba= sic >> serial RX/TX. Unfortunately even with all of this bypassing I get nothin= g >> out of the RS-232 port. What I don't know is if I could even expect >> something or if this is unlikely to bear fruit whether the hardware work= s >> or not. In any case, if I do get this thing running I'll have a writeup = for >> folks afterwards. If not, then hopefully I can figure out something usef= ul >> to do with this thing rather than junking it. >> > > Silly question... did you level shift to RS 232 levels? You likely did... > but if not... > > Warner > > - Matt G. >> ------- Original Message ------- >> On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 3:53 PM, rob@atvetsystems.com < >> rob@atvetsystems.com> wrote: >> >> Hello Matt, >> >> I=E2=80=99ve got one of these in my garage. I bought it about twenty yea= rs ago as >> a working system but when I got it home I noticed that the hard disk was= n=E2=80=99t >> connected but at some point I=E2=80=99d like to get it and my 3b2/300 wo= rking. >> >> Regards, Rob. >> >> On 3 Jan 2023, at 23:27, segaloco via TUHS wrote: >> >> And here are some pictures of the guts. >> >> https://imgur.com/a/E1ioxZl >> >> Various bits inside date this to late 1985. The good news is it at least >> turns on, but that's about as far as I've gotten with it. The display ne= ver >> turns on, nor do I hear any sounds indicating it tries to start the CRT. >> The fans kick on and there it stays until I turn it off. I plugged in a >> USB-TTY to pins 2, 3, and 7 (RX/TX/GND) and listened at 9600 baud 8 bit = 1 >> stop no parity and got nothing. Swapped the RX/TX, still nothing. Of >> course, that's all predicated on the assumption there's something there = to >> even interact with. I have little faith that whatever UNIX install was o= n >> this is extant. Additionally, it didn't come with a keyboard, so if ther= e >> was some futzing with key combos that would trigger some sort of UART ov= er >> those lines, I can't do that. I wonder if there are some contacts inside= I >> can just poll for activity with this serial connector, not sure how safe >> that is... >> >> Anywho, the CPU has a bit of corrosion on the surface, not sure how that >> bodes for the innards, but this is in kinda rough shape either way. I ho= pe >> I can salvage it but if not, I'm going to at least do some study on the = CRT >> particulars and see if I can extract and keep the monitor from it, been >> wanting a smaller CRT to have around for a while. >> >> - Matt G. >> ------- Original Message ------- >> On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 12:20 PM, segaloco via TUHS < >> tuhs@tuhs.org> wrote: >> >> Good day everyone, just starting a thread for yet another project I'll b= e >> tinkering on over time. Picked up a (presumably broken/untested) 7300 of= f >> eBay to at the very least tear down and get some good pictures of and, w= ith >> some luck, perhaps get working again. >> >> https://imgur.com/a/CExzebl >> >> Here are some pictures of the exterior for starters. I'll update this >> thread when I've got pictures of the guts and also with any info I can >> glean regarding whether this might be salvageable. The rust on the back = is >> pretty nasty but I've seen older/worse start up just fine. >> >> - Matt G. >> >> >> >> >> > --000000000000366a5c05f165aa57 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
https://www.amazon.com/NOYITO-Module-C= onversion-Arduino-communicates/dp/B07BJJ1T5G

is my g= o-to for when I need a simple one, though something like


might w= ork better for your setup if you just have more of the TTL gear than RS-232= gear (I have way too many old RS-232 cables because I never know when I= 9;ll need them again...)

Warner

On Tue, Jan 3= , 2023 at 5:46 PM segaloco <s= egaloco@protonmail.com> wrote:
Nope, unfortunately I only know as much as is needed to plug in= to the GPIO RX/TX/GND working on single boards. I wouldn't be surprised= if my assumption I just run these pins into the D-25 in the right holes is= bunk...but that's how we learn sometimes. Once I move I should be able= to setup a proper work bench where I can tinker on this sort of thing more= intentionally rather than haphazardly. So perhaps a silly question for an = expert but a valid one for me. I'll chase that angle and see if it bear= s fruit.

- Matt G.
------- Original Message -------
On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 4:40 PM, Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote:<= br>


On Tue, Jan 3, 2023, 5:30 PM segaloco via = TUHS <tuhs@tuhs.org> wrote:
I'd love to get my hands on a 3= B2 someday, this'll be cool if I can get it going but that'd be a m= uch more robust machine.

I'm starting to suspect if there isn't any sort= of boot ROM that spits out commentary on the UART and that doesn't get= flexed until UNIX is up, I may not be able to get very far. I referred to = http://bitsavers.trailing-edge.com/pdf/att/3b1/999-809-010IS= _UNIX_PC_Remote_Access_1986.pdf for the serial settings and it a= ppears:

9600 baud, 1 stop bit, no parity, 8 data bits

And the relevant pins
=

=
Pin 1 - GN= D
Pin= 2 - RX
Pin 3 - TX
Pin 4 - RTS
Pin 5 - CTS
Pin 6 - DSR
Pin 7 - GND
Pin 8 - DCD
Pin 20 - DTR

So I've plugged my = USB-TTY GND/RX/TX into the relevant pins and setup the necessary tty settin= gs. The manual then suggests if running null modem mode to short pin 4 to 5= and then pins 6, 8, and 20 together, presumably omitting any need for mode= m signalling from the remote machine, doing basic serial RX/TX. Unfortunate= ly even with all of this bypassing I get nothing out of the RS-232 port. Wh= at I don't know is if I could even expect something or if this is unlik= ely to bear fruit whether the hardware works or not. In any case, if I do g= et this thing running I'll have a writeup for folks afterwards. If not,= then hopefully I can figure out something useful to do with this thing rat= her than junking it.

Silly question... did you level shift to RS 232 level= s? You likely did... but if not...

Warner

- Matt G.
=
------- Original Message -------
On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 3:53 PM, rob@a= tvetsystems.com <rob@atvetsystems.com> wr= ote:

Hello Matt,

I=E2=80=99ve got one of these in= my garage. I bought it about twenty years ago as a working system but when= I got it home I noticed that the hard disk wasn=E2=80=99t connected but at= some point I=E2=80=99d like to get it and my 3b2/300 working.

=
Regards, Rob.

On 3 = Jan 2023, at 23:27, segaloco via TUHS <tuhs@tuhs.org>= ; wrote:

And here are some pictures of the guts.


Various bits ins= ide date this to late 1985. The good news is it at least turns on, but that= 's about as far as I've gotten with it. The display never turns on,= nor do I hear any sounds indicating it tries to start the CRT. The fans ki= ck on and there it stays until I turn it off. I plugged in a USB-TTY to pin= s 2, 3, and 7 (RX/TX/GND) and listened at 9600 baud 8 bit 1 stop no parity = and got nothing. Swapped the RX/TX, still nothing. Of course, that's al= l predicated on the assumption there's something there to even interact= with. I have little faith that whatever UNIX install was on this is extant= . Additionally, it didn't come with a keyboard, so if there was some fu= tzing with key combos that would trigger some sort of UART over those lines= , I can't do that. I wonder if there are some contacts inside I can jus= t poll for activity with this serial connector, not sure how safe that is..= .

Anywho, the CPU has a bit of corrosio= n on the surface, not sure how that bodes for the innards, but this is in k= inda rough shape either way. I hope I can salvage it but if not, I'm go= ing to at least do some study on the CRT particulars and see if I can extra= ct and keep the monitor from it, been wanting a smaller CRT to have around = for a while.

- Matt G.
------- Original Message -------
On Tuesday, January 3rd, 2023 at 12:20 PM, segaloco via TUHS <tuhs@tuhs.org> wrote:

Good day everyone, just starting a thread for yet another = project I'll be tinkering on over time. Picked up a (presumably broken/= untested) 7300 off eBay to at the very least tear down and get some good pi= ctures of and, with some luck, perhaps get working again.





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