From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 14709 invoked from network); 31 Dec 2020 21:35:11 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 31 Dec 2020 21:35:11 -0000 Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id A08029C7A4; Fri, 1 Jan 2021 07:35:08 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABFB79C78F; Fri, 1 Jan 2021 07:34:46 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.i=@bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.b="dZFGHWX2"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id B05039C78B; Fri, 1 Jan 2021 07:34:43 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-qt1-f181.google.com (mail-qt1-f181.google.com [209.85.160.181]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6210994B6C for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2021 07:34:42 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-qt1-f181.google.com with SMTP id b9so13527888qtr.2 for ; Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:34:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=15aG1uvKDUHdyZdo+OVRsuoH/F0XFlbEu1CH1pGAPrc=; b=dZFGHWX2ukDb6dflhRWsvqNd/Ihf5MzWxgP8aBmdY1sNWiKRpHPxFjUmrG3vNrcFLM lPp9ojKya/fJPnb4f9FxXdTPBUAcQv960Tp9TO2LCMiRkE4MPKXrlUYIzqlLaCHVkAF5 F32wxCyUbDulkHT5ku46O3erETilek9W991EsEkyDCB0J7imQbLvmysYOYgYOM9eIn+5 aeoEKU7DST6wzhalYBm5ymu0QrRsGazfW+QiR6lzZ6Vu81wGIuwfORzmI6SmC4RKHsLf jZ1EcjExSpMwAg1Qa7SZIXRWew7oy8hKCR2MUbxYZG/RxnyciHO/pqh0BEKxvbQq/qvn iR+A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=15aG1uvKDUHdyZdo+OVRsuoH/F0XFlbEu1CH1pGAPrc=; b=nK2n4rOPSlBXmODJtgLpCjS5rNUlOL5xWxOKb8C6JcFEX3M1XjRcXGGXmYiJ/y5pM9 hYT3sbB4R0qInnUheMrTZwbLuExixajo5sxWn1urbOv5LIPHpVDbd6B9EGDgdPmL/mFf C0yXaSQB75Mxs5STMVxlSt+PA7OYANAuZ+/I0oucBD91XhgVV3pkSbtqkUsmMqzV0rGv GOItbXgrUNnnWfGF0xx/Vr45YkLN5LE2lTOCURNmer5DoqChBRrSuw2bS5QD2FO5Wag3 GRyiUlhbHmNpNTWzkirKeqU13aQ4mFEpeQIP07mSnZVTAnDNdNz7wseGDZBd/YGQcbiC 8ECA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533LqFgt9V2tJPIOf05A6W2yURYii5T51n0BdznDitEiNywO8jQQ 9mVBQkzgBPisfZ3FYhqcZlKNaaynKCVAfbrUwfH2lA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyXMdDXQxRs9GrRvWq8rilzvTAb6sn5nbNEMRxAf0IAatMGiqSYZ2CgLUAuVXPp4PpgXt3PNvmqv1Wepn0NnRM= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:70c2:: with SMTP id g2mr56638859qtp.49.1609450481428; Thu, 31 Dec 2020 13:34:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <202012310810.0BV8ADZ3027195@freefriends.org> <950DAE25-BCAD-47EF-8FCE-A716271A3C25@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Thu, 31 Dec 2020 14:34:30 -0700 Message-ID: To: "Theodore Ts'o" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003ac08f05b7c96430" Subject: Re: [TUHS] The 2038 bug... X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --0000000000003ac08f05b7c96430 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Thu, Dec 31, 2020 at 11:37 AM Theodore Ts'o wrote: > Twenty years ago, one of larger customers for the company I was > working for at the time (VA Linux Systems) was one of the new > electronic stock exchanges, and they were using Linux boxes with > PDP-11 emulators because their stock trading software was written in > Macro-11 and running on RSTS/E. They had tried three times to rewrite > it so it could run on something more modern, but each time, the > rewrite had ended in failure. So they simply sharded the problem, so > one x86 server running RSTS/E in emulation would service stocks > symbols AAAA--ADZZ, and the next would service stocks AEAA--AFZZ, and > so on. Given that this was back in 1999, I assume they had solved the > Y2K problem one way or another, but even if they hadn't yet, I suspect > it would have been easier for them to fix the problem by asking their > dedicated Macro-11 Software Engineering team to fix it, than to ask > that same team to help the other team put themselves out of a job > (which for some reason, never seemed to happen successfully...) > This is the sort of reason why QBUS x86 machines exist... Not cheap, or easy to come by these days, but they filled a niche of emulation but with access to real hardware... Nor easy to find with a web search, it seems :(. There's a number of nuclear power plants that employ MACRO-11 programmers because they can't swap out the old gear w/o going through a prohibitively expensive recertification process... It's cheaper to hire and train good programmers than it is to go through that process :(. Warner --0000000000003ac08f05b7c96430 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Thu, Dec 31, 2020 at 11:37 AM Theo= dore Ts'o <tytso@mit.edu> wr= ote:
Twenty year= s ago, one of larger customers for the company I was
working for at the time (VA Linux Systems) was one of the new
electronic stock exchanges, and they were using Linux boxes with
PDP-11 emulators because their stock trading software was written in
Macro-11 and running on RSTS/E.=C2=A0 They had tried three times to rewrite=
it so it could run on something more modern, but each time, the
rewrite had ended in failure.=C2=A0 So they simply sharded the problem, so<= br> one x86 server running RSTS/E in emulation would service stocks
symbols AAAA--ADZZ, and the next would service stocks AEAA--AFZZ, and
so on.=C2=A0 Given that this was back in 1999, I assume they had solved the=
Y2K problem one way or another, but even if they hadn't yet, I suspect<= br> it would have been easier for them to fix the problem by asking their
dedicated Macro-11 Software Engineering team to fix it, than to ask
that same team to help the other team put themselves out of a job
(which for some reason, never seemed to happen successfully...)

This is the sort of reason why QBUS x86 machines e= xist...=C2=A0 Not cheap, or easy to come by these days, but they filled a n= iche of emulation but with access to real hardware... Nor easy to find with= a web search, it seems :(.

There's a number o= f nuclear power plants that employ MACRO-11 programmers because they can= 9;t swap out the old gear w/o going through a prohibitively expensive recer= tification process... It's cheaper to hire and train good programmers t= han it is to go through that process :(.

Warner=C2= =A0
--0000000000003ac08f05b7c96430--