From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,HTML_MESSAGE,MAILING_LIST_MULTI, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id d4afe899 for ; Thu, 8 Aug 2019 19:00:30 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 1CA399BBCE; Fri, 9 Aug 2019 05:00:29 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FA749BB77; Fri, 9 Aug 2019 04:59:40 +1000 (AEST) Authentication-Results: minnie.tuhs.org; dkim=fail reason="signature verification failed" (2048-bit key; unprotected) header.d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.i=@bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com header.b="pgrMkmfV"; dkim-atps=neutral Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 8CECC9BA8B; Fri, 9 Aug 2019 04:59:36 +1000 (AEST) Received: from mail-qk1-f176.google.com (mail-qk1-f176.google.com [209.85.222.176]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B57CC9BA7E for ; Fri, 9 Aug 2019 04:59:35 +1000 (AEST) Received: by mail-qk1-f176.google.com with SMTP id s145so69713879qke.7 for ; Thu, 08 Aug 2019 11:59:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=bsdimp-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=8guvlZ4+KmQC6ri5rdq/XcH8cS8inKODX3/wA+Cf9Pc=; b=pgrMkmfVoSjBEAH1aNAsBDRmNkNNaXvJgLGFzN+eV5JVTQmXE/Q3FTjT7gYfkWDx8u am3D6w4ueODSjmjodzl63WUFOCBg9Tt+4W2nJegT43Qm3cMsFgj8UAxcol+COjOERwy6 cZQxehAljsD/PAtKJLGzYPnDqjm/gN3eeliBhHSKv737CWy5kK3Pt9ySlF5LVMoYc906 OWZ/q9ki7x/CBtEHaa2sNbrEUM3q5n+jx0Xv0cstsUjvGkn9TzsWgsfTq3ajSWCiQGK7 jd4X4vxEG383mOKnGizCGEgeFu84Xxy2G+mSvvFijZURZsh7YfacREOlko5gIlcp7y5V V8MA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=8guvlZ4+KmQC6ri5rdq/XcH8cS8inKODX3/wA+Cf9Pc=; b=mrWE9XHRxL1FI5A+EQ+7wOedCkbBJ3BQaO4T4INLhR21LUbV3nKo1qSiWfNzYT5tcm s+gk+zUdk1B6xxmmDm1bmFmKIPFpdvWl+nAJ71/vVKm7KXzImgyziDzs4CB35/PFZgUM iHPlYkdTmPNC+nH5fOQ09dTKaKPWumCwVgTICobLyag04Bvl7vUwDABprSO++z6ppBSu DOwRLSMEzdpawr3xpWl4jCNpRCSRHR9VkLBdJLXto2nlpK8wZXmEgKdj+w/7r6qePZrB QvyEUbZQGHNnB3hVF26d8fy7rzcKscaGKBY3M3qxLJmfnSTXUl1xBrvOHsPwiSvDCDhY iurw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVCK8wI7oRl5P+i/QVmQKPRAStTft+aZ2pLOikM92WEEnkN3BO7 8j4VMDSuPlIQFxVYP90stS7mK+49JlNX7BRXxcQoDA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwAT4aVt1EpjkDu+BJXpnRT4Ipxnxgxgc4Xq3SmboCc5G+NzS4hmdK2S/2tSmZnCLuM+jSTmsO45S03mdXfAgM= X-Received: by 2002:a37:4804:: with SMTP id v4mr11411904qka.60.1565290774784; Thu, 08 Aug 2019 11:59:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <7236c9d4-40af-bc49-8aee-5c32d869d2eb@spamtrap.tnetconsulting.net> In-Reply-To: From: Warner Losh Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2019 12:59:23 -0600 Message-ID: To: Clem Cole Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009a04d7058f9fa800" Subject: Re: [TUHS] Pre-init initialization X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.26 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: The Unix Heritage Society , Grant Taylor Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" --0000000000009a04d7058f9fa800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Aug 8, 2019 at 7:43 AM Clem Cole wrote: > > > On Wed, Aug 7, 2019 at 12:40 PM Warner Losh wrote: > >> This obviated the need to copy a filesystem to a new disk's swap space >> and then use that to really install the system. >> > > Thanks for the reminder. I don't remember if V7 on the PDP-11 used the > swap space (but I don't think so). That said, I fairly sure that by BSD 4= .1 > the boot loader did, which I think is when that trick was first added to > boot phase. > Just checked the archives. V7 had a stand alone program to restore a filesystem image form the tape to the disk that you ran after running the stand alone program to partition and newfs the disk... I think you are right on your timeline. I installed a dozen Sun3 boxes from tape and hated mistyping the file number and having to start over... > Again, it was all about trying to get rid of the special /stand version o= f > things. Funny, history would move on and we come back to that idea with > busybox =F0=9F=A4=94 > Well, busybox is special in many ways, so there's that in common with /stand, but it runs under a full otherwise standard kernel, not as some special mini-exec that provides just enough of the unix APIs to keep the standalone programs happy. Warner --0000000000009a04d7058f9fa800 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Thu, Aug 8, 2019 at 7:43 AM Clem C= ole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote:


On Wed, Aug 7, 2019 at 12:40 PM Warner Losh <imp@bsdimp.com> wrote:
This obviate= d the need to copy a filesystem to a new disk's swap space and then use= that to really install the system.

=
Thanks for the remind= er.=C2=A0 =C2=A0I don't remember if V7 on the PDP-11 used the swap spac= e (but I don't think so). That said, I fairly sure that by BSD 4.1 the = boot loader did, which I think is when that trick was first added to boot p= hase.

Just checked the ar= chives. V7 had a stand alone program to restore a filesystem image form the= tape to the disk that you ran after running the stand alone program to par= tition and newfs the disk... I think you are right on your timeline. I inst= alled a dozen Sun3 boxes from tape and hated mistyping the file number and = having to start over...
=C2=A0
Again, it was all about trying = to get rid of the special /stand version of things.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Funny, hist= ory would move on and we come back to that idea with busybox=C2=A0=F0=9F=A4= =94

Well, busybox is spec= ial in many ways, so there's that in common with /stand, but it runs un= der a full otherwise standard kernel, not as some special mini-exec that pr= ovides just enough of the unix APIs to keep the standalone programs happy.<= /div>

Warner
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