From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,MAILING_LIST_MULTI,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 26015 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2022 21:32:01 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 4 Jul 2022 21:32:01 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1645D421DD; Tue, 5 Jul 2022 07:31:40 +1000 (AEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuhs.org; s=dkim; t=1656970300; h=from:from:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-owner:list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=42B7ey0E2FgK0+31APDhwu7W9T2Ll1fgfCQfwuTpqyY=; b=oEJyPWXNnJxCWK6q4a9GjnVvCAVYzfngHjZQd3GvsGrXBE2Otznd1kAm3FQGVld6KnnZTh aX27zpD83p9vNGDsE3qotPg/fQMu1efBfqmwqoMLIaHzB3fDexPRGNw+m1GeZkbtpB34Op 13rbWe+vNxtBT/4+L5FTW6gYncfncsc= Received: from ewsoutbound.kpnmail.nl (ewsoutbound.kpnmail.nl [195.121.94.170]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3A0FF421DC for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2022 07:31:23 +1000 (AEST) X-KPN-MessageId: a2ab3a0e-fbe0-11ec-8294-005056ab378f Received: from smtp.kpnmail.nl (unknown [10.31.155.40]) by ewsoutbound.so.kpn.org (Halon) with ESMTPS id a2ab3a0e-fbe0-11ec-8294-005056ab378f; Mon, 04 Jul 2022 23:31:16 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=planet.nl; s=planet01; h=to:message-id:date:from:subject:mime-version:content-type; bh=42B7ey0E2FgK0+31APDhwu7W9T2Ll1fgfCQfwuTpqyY=; b=fEMmwRBD49vHuXz7y3AeglCb47GN09n3ReLChhooim8gG0nc6PmeQQRnZ1FoKTPYW2BudjhtmqZbA /wWkX2Q++lA3gCkYCZ8hM94BVjBzKrKQBxYlMCO7qnDiuE2HzB9R6H7Go27lSrq3mesS/6K0g3NYxY s15KBtuNIYgPOb+E= X-KPN-MID: 33|7CBPWqnT41ZurwXQPVWTxHRCuoO/d+Ptx58E1O0qar0L6hLtvfYKbAwWokk+m8c ZPOpa2mnQb3IPoSJ97kjsCdnvpC3PoeLttwp9nMHy7NU= X-KPN-VerifiedSender: Yes X-CMASSUN: 33|M0Yro3ooMlmDO0vY1LjyrEKPq0nNqtFCdvrKzlLd12QC0AC+oEspYisd5Cu7Mvs VnIDYC0IKXm6gIJSdG6lmBg== X-Originating-IP: 77.172.38.96 Received: from smtpclient.apple (77-172-38-96.fixed.kpn.net [77.172.38.96]) by smtp.kpnmail.nl (Halon) with ESMTPSA id a2b49e6d-fbe0-11ec-9eb8-005056ab7584; Mon, 04 Jul 2022 23:31:16 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) In-Reply-To: <20220704204449.GT18597@mcvoy.com> Date: Mon, 4 Jul 2022 23:31:15 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <72C18447-E565-4A02-84E2-BFB309E97330@planet.nl> <20220704204449.GT18597@mcvoy.com> To: Larry McVoy X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Message-ID-Hash: CVRB3JYDHCY52UZQ6XS2BK7TWFHPE4S3 X-Message-ID-Hash: CVRB3JYDHCY52UZQ6XS2BK7TWFHPE4S3 X-MailFrom: pnr@planet.nl X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Re.: is networking different? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: From: Paul Ruizendaal via TUHS Reply-To: Paul Ruizendaal X-Spam: Yes > On 4 Jul 2022, at 22:44, Larry McVoy wrote: >=20 > On Mon, Jul 04, 2022 at 10:09:52PM +0200, Paul Ruizendaal via TUHS = wrote: >> With the above one could do >>=20 >> open("/net/inet/org.tuhs.www:80", O_RDWR | O_STREAM) >>=20 >> to connect to the TUHS web server, and do >>=20 >> open("/net/inet/any:80", O_RDWR | O_STREAM | O_CREAT, 0600) >>=20 >> to create a "listening" (rendez-vous) socket. >=20 > Decades ago, I tried to make a library that worked like this and it > was problematic. There are all sorts of setsockopt things that > you sometimes need to set. >=20 > I'd love to be wrong on this, if anyone has a working, for all of the > normal use cases, library like this, I'd love to see it. Wouldn=E2=80=99t setsockopt map nicely to ioctl when there is a file = system switch? The ioctl would switch into the network stack specific = version naturally. setsockopt(sd, SOL_SOCKET, SO_BROADCAST, &val, sizeof(int)) would become ioctl(sd, SO_BROADCAST, &val) More generally, the issue of meta-data and avoiding that ioctl becomes = an intractable dumping ground is not easy to solve.