From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_INVALID,DKIM_SIGNED, MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 5627 invoked from network); 22 Dec 2022 10:55:43 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 22 Dec 2022 10:55:43 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FCAC41B80; Thu, 22 Dec 2022 20:55:35 +1000 (AEST) Received: from ewsoutbound.kpnmail.nl (unknown [195.121.94.169]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E1B4A41B7F for ; Thu, 22 Dec 2022 20:55:16 +1000 (AEST) X-KPN-MessageId: 174c0271-81e7-11ed-97dd-005056abad63 Received: from smtp.kpnmail.nl (unknown [10.31.155.37]) by ewsoutbound.so.kpn.org (Halon) with ESMTPS id 174c0271-81e7-11ed-97dd-005056abad63; Thu, 22 Dec 2022 11:55:04 +0100 (CET) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=planet.nl; s=planet01; h=to:date:message-id:subject:mime-version:content-type:from; bh=Rt7oNNnG2sNv+zc4EuGg3MD0xhBgnxtH+YI6d+0PkqM=; b=xuZ17QSW628emETFj7QlZ+Rj42t0gPTqsQNb90wNclwSiWHey+Iy3llYXWM3I8G9bzFCPPE44aS9x UzD/Z/nXdpqSrnud+bOSRyHC08YD7dtfRDXLWZcSVSN3RpJKFScdw7F4a8UPToS/J5B0llju9m4fbb lT9CIMCeRGu224AU= X-KPN-MID: 33|+CV18F+ST7WsADsyLn9ccxWCU3YcAIs1MDv3IpPrqYbZ6o62AxHUfW0n7rPe7SE 1RtXNs/i9GZD4TpqvcK+bMZnK57VyKuyCAZFowR8zWQU= X-KPN-VerifiedSender: Yes X-CMASSUN: 33|2c6trvLG8sz+TIN5RMsgNfdXAq4Axh7OIfLD/mnL8MIyVIYbykbTd+ELDxyqfjL Dsu5iujtVWxBQsBi12NHFww== X-Originating-IP: 77.172.38.96 Received: from smtpclient.apple (77-172-38-96.fixed.kpn.net [77.172.38.96]) by smtp.kpnmail.nl (Halon) with ESMTPSA id 17443d7e-81e7-11ed-ae06-005056ab1411; Thu, 22 Dec 2022 11:55:05 +0100 (CET) From: Paul Ruizendaal Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.120.0.1.13\)) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 22 Dec 2022 11:55:04 +0100 To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.120.0.1.13) Message-ID-Hash: PVEXZ577SSRTL5XCASUWJNLO2CWUEAEL X-Message-ID-Hash: PVEXZ577SSRTL5XCASUWJNLO2CWUEAEL X-MailFrom: pnr@planet.nl X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Early Unix on (64-bit) Risc-V List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: Adam Thorton wrote: > I mean all I really want for Christmas is a 64-bit v7 with TCP/IP = support, a screen editor, and SMP support. >=20 > The third one is a solved problem. The second one would not be that = hard to adapt, say, uIP 0.9, to v7. That first one would require some = work with C type sizes, but getting larger is easier than the reverse. = It's that last one. >=20 > Having said that...maybe what I really want is 64-bit 4.3 BSD? >=20 > I mean, just a Unix, without all the cruft of a modern Linux, but = which can actually take advantage of the resources of a modern machine. = I don't care about a desktop, or even a graphical environment, I don't = care about all the strange syscalls that are there to support particular = databases, I don't care much about being a virtualization host. Luther Johnson wrote: > I'm in the process of building a system like that for myself, but=20 > perhaps a little smaller - mine will be based on an embedded=20 > microprocessor I've developed (so much work still yet to do ! at least = a=20 > year out). Earlier this year I ported VAX System III to Risc-V, to a simple = Allwinner D1 based SBC. This is RV64GC. Just ported to the console = terminal. It turned out that porting Sys III to 64 bit was surprisingly easy, most = of the kernel and user land appears to be 64 bit clean. It helps that I = am using a LLP64 compiler, though. Apart from networking Sys III also = feels surprisingly modern (for an ancient Unix) - its should get more = attention than it does. The hardest work was in porting the VAX memory = code to Risc-V page tables (and to a lesser extent, updating libc for = the different FP formats). The code is currently in an ugly state (with debug stuff in = commented-out blocks, a mix of ansi and K&R styles, an incoherent kludgy = build system, etc.) and the shame stopped me from putting it out on = gitlab until I found enough time to clean this up. As there seems to be = some interest now, I=E2=80=99ll put it up anyway in the next week or so. = There you go Adam, half your wish comes true. The kernel is about 60KB and most binaries are quite close in size to = the VAX equivalents. My next goals for it are to re-implement the Reiser demand paging (I = think I have a good enough view of how that worked, but the proof of the = pudding will be in the eating), and to add TCP/IP networking, probably = the BBN stack. Making it work on RV32 and exploring early SMP work is = also on my interest list. =3D=3D=3D David Arnold wrote: > I think xv6 does SMP? (param.h says NCPU =3D 8, at least). >=20 > You=E2=80=99d need to add a network stack and a userland, but there = are options for those =E2=80=A6 For the above, making xv6 work on the D1 board was my first stepping = stone, to proof the tool chain and to get the basics right (hardware = init, low-level I/O, etc.). As an educational tool, I am sure that xv6 hits all the right spots, and = it certainly does SMP (the D1 is single hart, so I have not tried that = myself). I like it a lot in that context. However, as a simple Unix it = is useless: from a user-land view it is less capable than LSX. At = minimum it needs fixes to make the file system less constrained. In my view, for SMP Keith Kelleman=E2=80=99s work for Sys-V is probably = a better place to start.