From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.1 (2015-04-28) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.1 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id d24ff488 for ; Mon, 2 Jul 2018 19:55:49 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 9A1BFA18BF; Tue, 3 Jul 2018 05:55:48 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A63AA183A; Tue, 3 Jul 2018 05:55:24 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id A4250A183A; Tue, 3 Jul 2018 05:55:18 +1000 (AEST) Received: from lb2-smtp-cloud7.xs4all.net (lb2-smtp-cloud7.xs4all.net [194.109.24.28]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 10D08A181A for ; Tue, 3 Jul 2018 05:55:17 +1000 (AEST) Received: from [192.168.1.107] ([80.101.112.122]) by smtp-cloud7.xs4all.net with ESMTPA id a4unfsdXd6brUa4upfiGKq; Mon, 02 Jul 2018 21:55:16 +0200 From: Paul Ruizendaal Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 11.4 \(3445.8.2\)) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2018 21:55:13 +0200 To: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.8.2) X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4wfFaE6H0xSUtiaue/iXQOOa/LkOf4mJ70xeqjRvtTm4gGT+4MSX1LA8d4ZRshQS3+efm9d/7F3QS1uqjWh64/79t2RxA9LW5YwDLR9zjDh5LxE+Reme2t yETESFG7nd0gJGwINSAiDTIW0g3x8cmbi2EIDukR2k3etXXhag+2CoNT Subject: Re: [TUHS] Any Good dmr Anecdotes? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" Not quite a dmr anecdote, but maybe this list can clear up a statement = that dmr reputedly made: =E2=80=9Cstreams means something different when = shouted=E2=80=9D. I think the claim goes back to around the turn of the millennium and as = far as I know it is not disputed that dmr either said this or could have = said this. Now, from reading this list over the years my understanding of the above = statement is that dmr designed streams as a mechanism to clean up the = kernel handling of line disciplines in a context of access via a = terminal and/or modem, and that STREAMS developed this into a way to = integrate network stacks with the kernel =E2=80=94 hence streams meant = something different when shouted. The original dmr paper (1984) on streams = (http://cm.bell-labs.co/who/dmr/st.html) seemed to support this = understanding, focussing on terminal handling in its discussion. Also, = near the end it says: "Streams are linear connections; by themselves, = they support no notion of multiplexing, fan-in or fan-out. [...] It = seems likely that a general multiplexing mechanism could help in both = cases, but again, I do not yet know how to design it.=E2=80=9D This = seemed to exclude usage for networking, which is typically multiplexed. However, now that the V8 sources are available it is clear that the = streams mechanism was used (by dmr?) to implement TCP/IP networking. He = explains how that tallies with the above quote on multiplexing in a 1985 = usenet post: = https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topicsearchin/net.unix-wizards/subject$3= Astreams/net.unix-wizards/b7W_j_0qASU (if the post by dmr does not immediately appear, click on the 8-10-85 = post by 'd...@dutoit.uucp=E2=80=99 to make it fold out: this is the = message I refer to). The way I read this usenet post, dmr was actually reasonably content = with implementing a network stack on top of (lowercase) streams. This = then implies that he was alluding to something else when saying = =E2=80=9Cstreams means something different when shouted=E2=80=9D (or = maybe he never said it). Any opinions on what he might have meant?