From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.0 required=5.0 tests=MAILING_LIST_MULTI, T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: (qmail 29695 invoked from network); 28 Jun 2022 10:39:50 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146) by inbox.vuxu.org with ESMTPUTF8; 28 Jun 2022 10:39:50 -0000 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FD1D40C85; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 20:39:28 +1000 (AEST) Received: from clarinet.employees.org (clarinet.employees.org [198.137.202.74]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E304E40C84 for ; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 20:39:14 +1000 (AEST) Received: by clarinet.employees.org (Postfix, from userid 1736) id A1C914E11B15; Tue, 28 Jun 2022 10:38:43 +0000 (UTC) Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2022 11:38:43 +0100 From: Derek Fawcus To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society Message-ID: References: <2803DC51-6CBC-4257-B40C-8A559C27CAE3@planet.nl> <20220625230939.GG19404@mcvoy.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Message-ID-Hash: 7MEJPFYRM2P2W77TQANMJLDD4YYOE2WP X-Message-ID-Hash: 7MEJPFYRM2P2W77TQANMJLDD4YYOE2WP X-MailFrom: dfawcus@employees.org X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; header-match-tuhs.tuhs.org-0; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Research Datakit notes List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: On Sun, Jun 26, 2022 at 09:57:17AM +1000, Rob Pike wrote: > One of the things we liked about Datakit was that the computer didn't have > to establish the connection before it could reject the call, unlike TCP/IP > where all validation happens after the connection is made. Nor does TCP, one can send a RST to a SYN, and reject the call before it is established. That would then look to the caller just like a non listening endpoint, unless one added data with the RST. So this is really just a consequence of the sockets API, and the current implementations. I've a vague recall of folks suggesting ways to expose that facility via the sockets layer, possibly using setsockopt(), but don't know if anyone ever did it. As I recall that TCP capability was actually exposed via the TLI/XTI API, and (for some STREAMS based TCP stacks) it did function. Although I may be thinking of embedded STREAMS TCP stacks, not unix based stacks. Or by 'connection' are you referring to an end-to-end packet delivery, and that Datakit allowed a closer switch to reject a call before the packet got to the far end? DF