From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, MAILING_LIST_MULTI,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [45.79.103.53]) by inbox.vuxu.org (OpenSMTPD) with ESMTP id 0d253256 for ; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 11:48:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id B9931A215C; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:48:42 +1000 (AEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C074AA2152; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:48:17 +1000 (AEST) Received: by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix, from userid 112) id 2019FA2152; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 20:20:52 +1000 (AEST) Received: from viclamta31p.bpe.bigpond.com (viclamta31p.bpe.bigpond.com [203.38.21.95]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 24347A214E for ; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 20:20:50 +1000 (AEST) Received: from smtp.telstra.com ([10.10.26.4]) by viclafep31p-svc.bpe.nexus.telstra.com.au with ESMTP id <20181101102048.RBP26344.viclafep31p-svc.bpe.nexus.telstra.com.au@smtp.telstra.com> for ; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:20:48 +1100 X-RG-Spam: Unknown X-RazorGate-Vade-Verdict: clean 0 X-RazorGate-Vade-Classification: clean X-RazorGate-Vade: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedtkedrieehgdduhecutefuodetggdotefrodftvfcurfhrohhfihhlvgemucfupfevtfgpvffgnffuvfftteenuceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpeffhffvufgjkfhffgggtgesthdttddttdervdenucfhrhhomhepffgrvhgvucfjohhrshhfrghllhcuoegurghvvgeshhhorhhsfhgrlhhlrdhorhhgqeenucfkphepuddutddrudeguddrudelfedrvdeffeenucfrrghrrghmpehhvghloheprghnvghurhhinhdrhhhorhhsfhgrlhhlrdhorhhgpdhinhgvthepuddutddrudeguddrudelfedrvdeffedpmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpeeouggrvhgvsehhohhrshhfrghllhdrohhrgheqpdhrtghpthhtohepoehtuhhhshesthhuhhhsrdhorhhgqeenucevlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedt X-RG-VS-CLASS: clean Received: from aneurin.horsfall.org (110.141.193.233) by smtp.telstra.com (9.0.019.26-1) id 5BB3FB50054C5859 for tuhs@tuhs.org; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:20:48 +1100 Received: from aneurin.horsfall.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by aneurin.horsfall.org (8.15.2/8.15.2) with ESMTP id wA1AKkEr080732 for ; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:20:46 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from dave@horsfall.org) Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by aneurin.horsfall.org (8.15.2/8.15.2/Submit) with ESMTP id wA1AKk1J080729 for ; Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:20:46 +1100 (EST) (envelope-from dave@horsfall.org) X-Authentication-Warning: aneurin.horsfall.org: dave owned process doing -bs Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2018 21:20:46 +1100 (EST) From: Dave Horsfall To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society In-Reply-To: <20181101074231.GA4844@vagabond> Message-ID: References: <20181031043810.GA10775@minnie.tuhs.org> <20181101074231.GA4844@vagabond> User-Agent: Alpine 2.21.9999 (BSF 287 2018-06-16) X-GPG-Public-Key: http://www.horsfall.org/gpgkey.pub X-GPG-Fingerprint: 05B4 FFBC 0218 B438 66E0 587B EF46 7357 EF5E F58B X-Home-Page: http://www.horsfall.org/ X-Witty-Saying: "chmod 666 the_mode_of_the_beast" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Subject: Re: [TUHS] Unix APIs: elegant or not? X-BeenThere: tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.20 Precedence: list List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: tuhs-bounces@minnie.tuhs.org Sender: "TUHS" On Thu, 1 Nov 2018, Pierre DAVID wrote: > Do you *really* think that IPC System V primitives are better than > sockets? Nope; they're even worse, which I didn't think was possible. The one saving grace (IMHO) of SysV was the TTY driver and its cleaner interface. I did see a proposal a while back (can't remember where/when) to use something like open("/dev/net/host/port", ...) to establish a network connection (or a server with appropriate flags), in much the same way that device files are created dynamically. With Unix, everything looks like a file, but as I said, the sockets API broke that convention, forcing users to work at a much lower level than necessary. I suppose that around now someone will say that Plan 9 fixed all that :-) -- Dave