[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 471 bytes --] El mié., 6 nov. 2019 4:37, Charles H. Sauer <sauer@technologists.com> escribió: > > When I left IBM at the beginning of May 1989, I was running AOS on my home > RT and AIX 2.2 on my office machine > With permisión, I have one question fron years about this... Is it AOS stuff saved and available (including source code) un some place on the Internet? I would ask too about some kind of emulator of the IBM/RT, but I never find one. Regards Sergio [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1045 bytes --]
I'm not aware of AOS source anywhere, but plausibly someone from Athena or CMU might still have it. If I recall correctly, it came on large tape cartridges. There was some AOS stuff at www.dementia.org/~shadow/ibmrt.html, some still present at http://web.archive.org/web/20110725231604/http://www.dementia.org/~shadow/ibmrt.html, but the ftp stuff seems to be gone. Also some AOS stuff at https://amaus.net/static/S100/IBM/RTPC/AOS/. I'm not aware of RT or 6K emulators available. I think there is more recent AIX on SIMH (https://astr0baby.wordpress.com/2018/11/04/running-aix-7-2-tl3sp1-on-x86_64-via-qemu-system-ppc64/), but I've not looked at it. CHS On 11/6/2019 1:59 AM, SPC wrote: > > > El mié., 6 nov. 2019 4:37, Charles H. Sauer <sauer@technologists.com > <mailto:sauer@technologists.com>> escribió: > > > When I left IBM at the beginning of May 1989, I was running AOS on > my home RT and AIX 2.2 on my office machine > > > With permisión, I have one question fron years about this... Is it AOS > stuff saved and available (including source code) un some place on the > Internet? > > I would ask too about some kind of emulator of the IBM/RT, but I never > find one. > > Regards > Sergio > -- voice: +1.512.784.7526 e-mail: sauer@technologists.com fax: +1.512.346.5240 Web: https://technologists.com/sauer/ Facebook/Google/Skype/Twitter: CharlesHSauer
I may still have AOS 4.3 tape images still around somewhere. I will have to search around and see if I still have them. Though even if I do, I'm not sure if the license would permit me to make them available - if I recall correctly, this wasn't an actual LPP, but there may be some IBM license on this over and above the Berkeley license. Yes, it did come on tape cartridges. --Pat.
Also, I'm still in touch with shadow, I can ask if there's a mirror of that IBM RT page still around. --Pat.
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 296 bytes --] On 11/6/19 8:51 AM, Charles H Sauer wrote: > I think there is more recent AIX on SIMH I know someone who has booted and run AIX 7.<something> under SimH. I don't know how different the emulation SimH is doing to allow that to run vs an RS/6000. -- Grant. . . . unix || die [-- Attachment #2: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature --] [-- Type: application/pkcs7-signature, Size: 4008 bytes --]
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 597 bytes --] Aix is kind of running on Qemu... I've run 4.12 although the networking wasn't running, but enough to uuencode stuff through the console. Get Outlook for Android On Fri, Nov 8, 2019 at 7:41 AM +0900, "Grant Taylor via TUHS" <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> wrote: On 11/6/19 8:51 AM, Charles H Sauer wrote: > I think there is more recent AIX on SIMH I know someone who has booted and run AIX 7. under SimH. I don't know how different the emulation SimH is doing to allow that to run vs an RS/6000. -- Grant. . . . unix || die [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1376 bytes --]
On 11/5/19 11:59 PM, SPC wrote:
>
>
> Is it AOS stuff saved and available (including source code)
> un some place on the Internet?
It was, and may still be in the afs heirarchy
I'm not going to say where, or how complete what was there is
I also seem to remember it still sat on top of an AIX microkernel
and didn't go down to bare metal.
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 962 bytes --] On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 1:33 AM Al Kossow <aek@bitsavers.org> wrote: > > > On 11/5/19 11:59 PM, SPC wrote: > > > > > > Is it AOS stuff saved and available (including source code) > > un some place on the Internet? > > It was, and may still be in the afs heirarchy > I'm not going to say where, or how complete what was there is > I also seem to remember it still sat on top of an AIX microkernel > and didn't go down to bare metal. > No, that's not true. AOS was basically 4.3BSD Tahoe plus NFS and it ran on bare RT hardware. There was source code available to universities, though as I recall some bits related to memory management were missing and distributed as object files. I gathered, at the time, this was due to some obscure intellectual property reasons. People later tried to Port e.g. 4.4BSD to aging RT hardware and found it challenging because the memory subsystem was so different. But anyway, there was no hypervisor involved. - Dan C. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1459 bytes --]
Dan Cross <crossd@gmail.com> writes: > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 1:33 AM Al Kossow <aek@bitsavers.org> wrote: > >> >> >> On 11/5/19 11:59 PM, SPC wrote: >> > >> > >> > Is it AOS stuff saved and available (including source code) >> > un some place on the Internet? >> >> It was, and may still be in the afs heirarchy >> I'm not going to say where, or how complete what was there is >> I also seem to remember it still sat on top of an AIX microkernel >> and didn't go down to bare metal. >> > > No, that's not true. AOS was basically 4.3BSD Tahoe plus NFS and it ran on > bare RT hardware. There was source code available to universities, though > as I recall some bits related to memory management were missing and > distributed as object files. I gathered, at the time, this was due to some > obscure intellectual property reasons. People later tried to Port e.g. > 4.4BSD to aging RT hardware and found it challenging because the memory > subsystem was so different. > > But anyway, there was no hypervisor involved. > > - Dan C. For a brief time a long time ago, I used a 4.3BSD based Mt. Xinu, MACH microkernel, OS on the IBM-RT as an alternative to AOS. Ran well enough, but was disk and memory constrained. We had source to much of the system (or perhaps all of it, don't remember), but I seem to recall that compiling it was a big pain. Something like you had to use a specific compiler (perhaps referred to as High C?? hc command perhaps) to compile some of the source. gcc had a backend for the ROMP processor, but it had a hard time making usable binaries. I think that some variation of pcc was the usual compiler. I remember it being pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. We used them mostly as X terminal workstations. -- Brad Spencer - brad@anduin.eldar.org - KC8VKS - http://anduin.eldar.org
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2716 bytes --] On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 8:07 AM Brad Spencer <brad@anduin.eldar.org> wrote: > For a brief time a long time ago, I used a 4.3BSD based Mt. Xinu, MACH > microkernel, OS on the IBM-RT as an alternative to AOS. Ran well > enough, but was disk and memory constrained. We had source to much of > the system (or perhaps all of it, don't remember), but I seem to recall > that compiling it was a big pain. Something like you had to use a > specific compiler (perhaps referred to as High C?? hc command perhaps) > to compile some of the source. gcc had a backend for the ROMP > processor, but it had a hard time making usable binaries. I think that > some variation of pcc was the usual compiler. I remember it being > pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. We used them mostly as X > terminal workstations. > "High C" (or perhaps "Hi C"? It's been a while...) was the name of the system compiler on AOS; I thought it was installed as `cc`. I don't recall a pcc-derived compiler, but apparently such a thing did exist and some documentation says that High C was installed as `hc`, so my memory may be off. This old post describes RT compilers: https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.sys.ibm.pc.rt/u7DUwY5U9kQ/uVqLP9FhqMEJ Hi-C was sort of an odd compiler. I gather IBM outsourced the development of it to some third party (MetaWare) which was founded by very religious people, and I have a vague memory of some of the documentation or perhaps even error messages making biblical references. The kernel had to be built with High C, if I recall correctly, though GCC worked OK for producing userspace binaries. I don't recall what the bug was, but it was eventually found and fixed. Perhaps it had to do with incomplete register saves on function entry interacting poorly with interrupts or something. Some RT enthusiasts kept those machines running well beyond their prime. Why? I'm not entirely sure; as you say, they were memory and disk constrained. They were also very slow. Anyway, I have some vague recollection that at some point the bug in the compiler was fixed so that GCC could produce a working kernel; nascent NetBSD and OpenBSD ports were planned, but I don't think they ever went anywhere. https://www.openbsd.org/romp.html exists, though I don't know that the NetBSD people ever got beyond the talking stage. The OpenBSD-romp mailing list had some interesting information, but I can't find archives anymore. Oh well. The RT was an interesting footnote in the history of computing, but it seems that, as a workstation, it was too little too late by the time it actually hit the market. Had they released it a few years earlier? Perhaps they could have cornered the market. - Dan C. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 3423 bytes --]
On 11/21/19 9:19 AM, Dan Cross wrote: > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 8:07 AM Brad Spencer <brad@anduin.eldar.org > <mailto:brad@anduin.eldar.org>> wrote: > > For a brief time a long time ago, I used a 4.3BSD based Mt. Xinu, MACH > microkernel, OS on the IBM-RT as an alternative to AOS. Ran well > enough, but was disk and memory constrained. We had source to much of > the system (or perhaps all of it, don't remember), but I seem to recall > that compiling it was a big pain. Something like you had to use a > specific compiler (perhaps referred to as High C?? hc command perhaps) > to compile some of the source. gcc had a backend for the ROMP > processor, but it had a hard time making usable binaries. I think that > some variation of pcc was the usual compiler. I remember it being > pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. We used them mostly as X > terminal workstations. > > > "High C" (or perhaps "Hi C"? It's been a while...) was the name of the > system compiler on AOS; I thought it was installed as `cc`. "High C", and it was installed as cc and hc. > Some RT enthusiasts kept those machines running well beyond their prime. > Why? I'm not entirely sure; as you say, they were memory and disk > constrained. They were also very slow. I had one running in my basement into the late 90s, with my own self- maintained kernel. I did a considerable portion of the bash-2.0 development on that box, and my wife wrote all of her doctoral thesis on it (using a troff macro package I wrote to do APA style formatting). It didn't make the cut when I moved from that house. Why did I have it? Because it was free, and it did what I needed. -- ``The lyf so short, the craft so long to lerne.'' - Chaucer ``Ars longa, vita brevis'' - Hippocrates Chet Ramey, UTech, CWRU chet@case.edu http://tiswww.cwru.edu/~chet/
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 3085 bytes --] You're quite right about the religious error messages. I used MetaWare High C under DOS briefly, comparing it to Turbo C and Watcom. (Watcom won.) It had extensions to C, such as a coroutine-ish 'yield' keyword. On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 9:20 AM Dan Cross <crossd@gmail.com> wrote: > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 8:07 AM Brad Spencer <brad@anduin.eldar.org> > wrote: > >> For a brief time a long time ago, I used a 4.3BSD based Mt. Xinu, MACH >> microkernel, OS on the IBM-RT as an alternative to AOS. Ran well >> enough, but was disk and memory constrained. We had source to much of >> the system (or perhaps all of it, don't remember), but I seem to recall >> that compiling it was a big pain. Something like you had to use a >> specific compiler (perhaps referred to as High C?? hc command perhaps) >> to compile some of the source. gcc had a backend for the ROMP >> processor, but it had a hard time making usable binaries. I think that >> some variation of pcc was the usual compiler. I remember it being >> pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. We used them mostly as X >> terminal workstations. >> > > "High C" (or perhaps "Hi C"? It's been a while...) was the name of the > system compiler on AOS; I thought it was installed as `cc`. I don't recall > a pcc-derived compiler, but apparently such a thing did exist and some > documentation says that High C was installed as `hc`, so my memory may be > off. This old post describes RT compilers: > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/comp.sys.ibm.pc.rt/u7DUwY5U9kQ/uVqLP9FhqMEJ > > Hi-C was sort of an odd compiler. I gather IBM outsourced the development > of it to some third party (MetaWare) which was founded by very religious > people, and I have a vague memory of some of the documentation or perhaps > even error messages making biblical references. > > The kernel had to be built with High C, if I recall correctly, though GCC > worked OK for producing userspace binaries. I don't recall what the bug > was, but it was eventually found and fixed. Perhaps it had to do with > incomplete register saves on function entry interacting poorly with > interrupts or something. > > Some RT enthusiasts kept those machines running well beyond their prime. > Why? I'm not entirely sure; as you say, they were memory and disk > constrained. They were also very slow. Anyway, I have some vague > recollection that at some point the bug in the compiler was fixed so that > GCC could produce a working kernel; nascent NetBSD and OpenBSD ports were > planned, but I don't think they ever went anywhere. > https://www.openbsd.org/romp.html exists, though I don't know that the > NetBSD people ever got beyond the talking stage. The OpenBSD-romp mailing > list had some interesting information, but I can't find archives anymore. > > Oh well. The RT was an interesting footnote in the history of computing, > but it seems that, as a workstation, it was too little too late by the time > it actually hit the market. Had they released it a few years earlier? > Perhaps they could have cornered the market. > > - Dan C. > > > [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 4041 bytes --]
On 11/21/2019 5:58 AM, Dan Cross wrote: > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 1:33 AM Al Kossow <aek@bitsavers.org > <mailto:aek@bitsavers.org>> wrote: > It was, and may still be in the afs heirarchy > I'm not going to say where, or how complete what was there is > I also seem to remember it still sat on top of an AIX microkernel > and didn't go down to bare metal. > > > No, that's not true. AOS was basically 4.3BSD Tahoe plus NFS and it ran > on bare RT hardware. There was source code available to universities, > though as I recall some bits related to memory management were missing > and distributed as object files. I gathered, at the time, this was due > to some obscure intellectual property reasons. People later tried to > Port e.g. 4.4BSD to aging RT hardware and found it challenging because > the memory subsystem was so different. > > But anyway, there was no hypervisor involved. There may well have been AFS for AIX and thus the confusion about hypervisor (AIX VRM). -- voice: +1.512.784.7526 e-mail: sauer@technologists.com fax: +1.512.346.5240 Web: https://technologists.com/sauer/ Facebook/Google/Skype/Twitter: CharlesHSauer
On 11/21/2019 7:07 AM, Brad Spencer wrote: > ... I remember it being > pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. I'm puzzled about the "minus YP/NIS". I negotiated the IBM NFS license on behalf of AIX, but was inclusive of the rest of the company, so I think ACIS put NFS into AOS under the auspices of that license. I remember discussing with the Palo Alto ACIS folks at the time. I only had AOS at home, without Ethernet, so wouldn't have tried to use NFS or YP. But I would have thought that ACIS would have included YP. Charlie -- voice: +1.512.784.7526 e-mail: sauer@technologists.com fax: +1.512.346.5240 Web: https://technologists.com/sauer/ Facebook/Google/Skype/Twitter: CharlesHSauer
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 718 bytes --] On Thu, Nov 21, 2019, 12:34 PM Charles H Sauer <sauer@technologists.com> wrote: > > > On 11/21/2019 7:07 AM, Brad Spencer wrote: > > > ... I remember it being > > pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. > > I'm puzzled about the "minus YP/NIS". I negotiated the IBM NFS license > on behalf of AIX, but was inclusive of the rest of the company, so I > think ACIS put NFS into AOS under the auspices of that license. I > remember discussing with the Palo Alto ACIS folks at the time. > > I only had AOS at home, without Ethernet, so wouldn't have tried to use > NFS or YP. But I would have thought that ACIS would have included YP. > AOS definitely had NIS/YP. I remember it quite distinctly. - Dan C. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 1188 bytes --]
Charles H Sauer <sauer@technologists.com> writes: > On 11/21/2019 7:07 AM, Brad Spencer wrote: > >> ... I remember it being >> pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. > > I'm puzzled about the "minus YP/NIS". I negotiated the IBM NFS license > on behalf of AIX, but was inclusive of the rest of the company, so I > think ACIS put NFS into AOS under the auspices of that license. I > remember discussing with the Palo Alto ACIS folks at the time. > > I only had AOS at home, without Ethernet, so wouldn't have tried to use > NFS or YP. But I would have thought that ACIS would have included YP. > > Charlie I was referring to the Mt. Xinu Mach based 4.3BSD OS that replaced AIX on the RTs I was using. Aside from the 4.3BSD part, it didn't have AIX involved... and it didn't have YP/NIS. -- Brad Spencer - brad@anduin.eldar.org - KC8VKS - http://anduin.eldar.org
greg travis <greg.m.travis@gmail.com> wrote:
> You're quite right about the religious error messages.
The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too. I remember flipping through some
of the early manuals and there are a number of references to needing
divine help if things go badly wrong, praying for divine guidance,
and so on. :-) (Yes, I know that was mainly cultural. Still, it
was striking, at least to me.)
Arnold
> From: Arnold Robbins > The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too. And there's the famous? story about the Multics error messages in Latin, courtesty of Bernie Greenberg. One actually appeared at a customer site once, whereupon hilarity ensued. Noel
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1250 bytes --] On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 2:53 PM Noel Chiappa <jnc@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> wrote: > > From: Arnold Robbins > > > The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too. > > And there's the famous? story about the Multics error messages in Latin, > courtesty of Bernie Greenberg. One actually appeared at a customer site > once, > whereupon hilarity ensued. > One of my favorite stories of the same vein was a masscomp story. We were chasing a rare event (as I recall it was when we first were debugging Multiprocessor stuff and it a lock order problem). But we could not get the customers to tell us about what was happening, since the system recovered quickly, but we might kill a process. We had done a few releases and make a few changes but we could never reproduce it. I never knew who it was but someone ??Jack Burness if I had to guess?? put out a patch with a couple of error messages in Klingon and dumped a bunch of information. Sure enough this was noticed, customer stopped, we got the needed data, as they reported the error. But it was a high visibility customer, so the president (Mr. Potatohead) got a phone call. Fossil (our boss) made us swear it would never happen again, but he defended us to the President. We found the bug ;-) [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 2051 bytes --]
arnold@skeeve.com writes:
> greg travis <greg.m.travis@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > You're quite right about the religious error messages.
>
> The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too. I remember flipping through some
> of the early manuals and there are a number of references to needing
> divine help if things go badly wrong, praying for divine guidance,
> and so on. :-) (Yes, I know that was mainly cultural. Still, it
> was striking, at least to me.)
>
> Arnold
I believe that you're talking about the "gerts" command and if you ever had
to use it, you'd know that the divine guidance part was accurate.
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2720 bytes --] On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 11:16 AM Chet Ramey <chet.ramey@case.edu> wrote: > On 11/21/19 9:19 AM, Dan Cross wrote: > > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 8:07 AM Brad Spencer <brad@anduin.eldar.org > > <mailto:brad@anduin.eldar.org>> wrote: > > > > For a brief time a long time ago, I used a 4.3BSD based Mt. Xinu, > MACH > > microkernel, OS on the IBM-RT as an alternative to AOS. Ran well > > enough, but was disk and memory constrained. We had source to much > of > > the system (or perhaps all of it, don't remember), but I seem to > recall > > that compiling it was a big pain. Something like you had to use a > > specific compiler (perhaps referred to as High C?? hc command > perhaps) > > to compile some of the source. gcc had a backend for the ROMP > > processor, but it had a hard time making usable binaries. I think > that > > some variation of pcc was the usual compiler. I remember it being > > pretty stock 4.3BSD with NFS and minus YP/NIS. We used them mostly > as X > > terminal workstations. > > > > > > "High C" (or perhaps "Hi C"? It's been a while...) was the name of the > > system compiler on AOS; I thought it was installed as `cc`. > > "High C", and it was installed as cc and hc. > Yeah, that matches my (vague) recollection as well. > Some RT enthusiasts kept those machines running well beyond their prime. > > Why? I'm not entirely sure; as you say, they were memory and disk > > constrained. They were also very slow. > > I had one running in my basement into the late 90s, with my own self- > maintained kernel. I did a considerable portion of the bash-2.0 > development on that box, and my wife wrote all of her doctoral thesis on > it (using a troff macro package I wrote to do APA style formatting). It > didn't make the cut when I moved from that house. Why did I have it? > Because it was free, and it did what I needed. > We kept a couple of them running through the mid- to late-90s as well. By that time, however, it seemed like Linux and the BSDs on PCs had greatly eclipsed whatever was possible performance or software-wise on the aging RTs, which were also starting to fail in odd ways. But until that point, they were free and ran Unix, and for a long time that was kind of a special thing. We ended up replacing a 6150 with a 486 running FreeBSD and life was pretty good, though. The spiritual descendent of that (those) machine(s) now runs OpenBSD on a VPS somewhere. A while back, I found some old NIS data files (in ndbm format, of course) that we'd preserved from some ancient backup; I was able to get the ndbm library from an old BSD distribution and compile it and extract the data, which was kind of fun. - Dan C. [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 3612 bytes --]
On 11/21/19 3:58 AM, Dan Cross wrote:
> But anyway, there was no hypervisor involved.
Sorry, got it mixed up in my mind with aix
I had remembered bits of the kernel were missing, but I forgot why.
Hello!
Clem by chance do you remember what the error message response was? It
would be interesting to see what phrases were used. For example, on
the IBM side of things, a fellow Adam and I both know, coded an entire
application so that everything it said and did would be in Klingonese.
No I do not remember which one it was, and what have you, I only
remember it surfacing during his talk at the IBM offices here in town,
during the early years of running Tux on the IBM S/390 systems.
I also find it strange that sometimes even Google is thinking in that language.
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."
On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 3:09 PM Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 2:53 PM Noel Chiappa <jnc@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> wrote:
>>
>> > From: Arnold Robbins
>>
>> > The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too.
>>
>> And there's the famous? story about the Multics error messages in Latin,
>> courtesty of Bernie Greenberg. One actually appeared at a customer site once,
>> whereupon hilarity ensued.
>
> One of my favorite stories of the same vein was a masscomp story. We were chasing a rare event (as I recall it was when we first were debugging Multiprocessor stuff and it a lock order problem). But we could not get the customers to tell us about what was happening, since the system recovered quickly, but we might kill a process. We had done a few releases and make a few changes but we could never reproduce it.
>
> I never knew who it was but someone ??Jack Burness if I had to guess?? put out a patch with a couple of error messages in Klingon and dumped a bunch of information. Sure enough this was noticed, customer stopped, we got the needed data, as they reported the error. But it was a high visibility customer, so the president (Mr. Potatohead) got a phone call. Fossil (our boss) made us swear it would never happen again, but he defended us to the President. We found the bug ;-)
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2631 bytes --] No I don't remember Many details on this one as I did not do it. As I said I think it was a Burness message in the graphics subsystem, but I cannot swear to it. I just remember the time frame and what happened. Roger Gourd's reaction was priceless when Mr Potatohead called us on it. It was one of the times I really learned to respect Roger. That said, Ill see what I can find by asking around. On Fri, Nov 22, 2019 at 11:41 PM Gregg Levine <gregg.drwho8@gmail.com> wrote: > Hello! > Clem by chance do you remember what the error message response was? It > would be interesting to see what phrases were used. For example, on > the IBM side of things, a fellow Adam and I both know, coded an entire > application so that everything it said and did would be in Klingonese. > No I do not remember which one it was, and what have you, I only > remember it surfacing during his talk at the IBM offices here in town, > during the early years of running Tux on the IBM S/390 systems. > > I also find it strange that sometimes even Google is thinking in that > language. > ----- > Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@gmail.com > "This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again." > > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 3:09 PM Clem Cole <clemc@ccc.com> wrote: > > > > > > > > On Thu, Nov 21, 2019 at 2:53 PM Noel Chiappa <jnc@mercury.lcs.mit.edu> > wrote: > >> > >> > From: Arnold Robbins > >> > >> > The Bell Labs guys in some ways were too. > >> > >> And there's the famous? story about the Multics error messages in Latin, > >> courtesty of Bernie Greenberg. One actually appeared at a customer site > once, > >> whereupon hilarity ensued. > > > > One of my favorite stories of the same vein was a masscomp story. We > were chasing a rare event (as I recall it was when we first were debugging > Multiprocessor stuff and it a lock order problem). But we could not get > the customers to tell us about what was happening, since the system > recovered quickly, but we might kill a process. We had done a few releases > and make a few changes but we could never reproduce it. > > > > I never knew who it was but someone ??Jack Burness if I had to guess?? > put out a patch with a couple of error messages in Klingon and dumped a > bunch of information. Sure enough this was noticed, customer stopped, we > got the needed data, as they reported the error. But it was a high > visibility customer, so the president (Mr. Potatohead) got a phone call. > Fossil (our boss) made us swear it would never happen again, but he > defended us to the President. We found the bug ;-) > -- Sent from a handheld expect more typos than usual [-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 3418 bytes --]