From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on inbox.vuxu.org X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=DKIM_SIGNED,DKIM_VALID, DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,MAILING_LIST_MULTI autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (minnie.tuhs.org [IPv6:2600:3c01:e000:146::1]) by inbox.vuxu.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36C0228926 for ; Mon, 27 May 2024 19:38:05 +0200 (CEST) Received: from minnie.tuhs.org (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EE4C435E9; Tue, 28 May 2024 03:38:00 +1000 (AEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuhs.org; s=dkim; t=1716831480; h=from:from:reply-to:reply-to:subject:subject:date:date: message-id:message-id:to:to:cc:cc:mime-version:mime-version: content-type:content-type: content-transfer-encoding:content-transfer-encoding: in-reply-to:in-reply-to:references:references:list-id:list-help: list-owner:list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post; bh=3FIjs1QypJhbI0MC2thiPOQXqf6AhqYA88Sdk7rv2Es=; b=MUiriTPgdJrfW+WFApH8NBKOq53qy8zpvcNC0lK0WrK6RJ+/HIJxLI0He1RDlXor+gGpOO wnzp+Oi26z0CJf2S3sl9tACXKajQujaW0fgsozoG5PhsjKCcQyKbwKRmq7Lt4PQG/MSR3c TP4ekQO1mIjreR3L+jIKEaix0NXnIi8= Received: from mail-4319.protonmail.ch (mail-4319.protonmail.ch [185.70.43.19]) by minnie.tuhs.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ABDE641644 for ; Tue, 28 May 2024 03:37:49 +1000 (AEST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=protonmail.com; s=protonmail3; t=1716831467; x=1717090667; bh=3FIjs1QypJhbI0MC2thiPOQXqf6AhqYA88Sdk7rv2Es=; h=Date:To:From:Cc:Subject:Message-ID:In-Reply-To:References: Feedback-ID:From:To:Cc:Date:Subject:Reply-To:Feedback-ID: Message-ID:BIMI-Selector; b=gYx7Ai+IwAmzq0I6uAgJVXbRxzUg0uITf91tWw1VZQHe0IFbx2OlmF1jEPv+tzr/+ S+snotf2Ojf4klVN5uRWG1FDtEvkVwhxmjSoMG7GoieWBIo4VYh0HuyW5ETigVbSrP U4El8osXCI+0UD84zZ71T+MotjC5Dlvie25La5PlixU6TRaEUcbI1f1k65eMFwv4X3 Fhqlg+eWTblyXoNhLXIWLJEyYysGydpSMwxoLjMpzjxevL49suHPuiT98artBg7V7j iSAZLunSoWMMWOpaYQcYFxQ00/2FQbi6I9v3iI0zgsgVs9lJorRqHvI2CbjNYUt+w1 R6M7yVKCo5fTA== Date: Mon, 27 May 2024 17:37:40 +0000 To: Alan Glasser Message-ID: In-Reply-To: References: Feedback-ID: 35591162:user:proton X-Pm-Message-ID: b62465bb9d6fdf269e3bf5f37e1ab9df6d0d70dc MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID-Hash: 5EZ3CKIVAACNNNTKY2FNEJ7KVGJBKOKF X-Message-ID-Hash: 5EZ3CKIVAACNNNTKY2FNEJ7KVGJBKOKF X-MailFrom: segaloco@protonmail.com X-Mailman-Rule-Misses: dmarc-mitigation; no-senders; approved; emergency; loop; banned-address; member-moderation; nonmember-moderation; administrivia; implicit-dest; max-recipients; max-size; news-moderation; no-subject; digests; suspicious-header CC: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society X-Mailman-Version: 3.3.6b1 Precedence: list Subject: [TUHS] Re: Did UNIX Ever Touch SPC-SWAP, EPL, or EPLX (1A Languages)? List-Id: The Unix Heritage Society mailing list Archived-At: List-Archive: List-Help: List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: From: segaloco via TUHS Reply-To: segaloco X-Spam: Yes On Saturday, May 25th, 2024 at 3:28 PM, Alan Glasser wrote: > Matt, > First, sorry for the delayed response. >=20 > In around 1994 through late 1996 I worked on the FlashPort project in Bel= l Labs. > A significant project that we completed was FlashPort'ing the 4ESS SWAP a= ssembler from TSS/360 to Solaris. > My memory is that the 4E team wanted to get off of TSS and onto Unix. >=20 > Alan >=20 > https://techmonitor.ai/technology/emulator_house_echo_logic_folded_back_i= nto_att >=20 >=20 > On Fri, Apr 5, 2024 at 12:59=E2=80=AFAM segaloco via TUHS = wrote: >=20 > > So I've been doing a bit of reading on 1A and 4ESS technologies lately,= getting > > a feel for the state of things just prior to 3B and 5ESS popping onto t= he scene, > > and came across some BSTJ references to the programming environments in= volved > > in the 4ESS and TSPS No. 1 systems. > >=20 > > The general assembly system targeting the 1A machine language was known= as > > SPC-SWAP (SWitching Assembly Program)[1](p. 206) and ran under OS/360/3= 70, with > > editing typically performed in QED. This then gave way to the EPL (ESS > > Programming Language) and ultimately EPLX (EPL eXtra)[2](p. 1)[3](p. 8) > > languages which, among other things, were used for later 4ESS work with= cross- > > compilers for at least TSS/360 by the sounds of it. > >=20 > > Are there any recollections of attempts by the Bell System to rebase an= y of > > these 1A-targeting environments into UNIX, or by the time UNIX was bein= g > > considered more broadly for Bell System projects, was 3B/5ESS technolog= y well on > > the way, rendering attempting to move entrenched IBM-based environments= for the > > older switching computation systems moot? > >=20 > > For the record, in addition to the evolution of ESS to the 5ESS generat= ion, a > > revision of TSPS, 1B, was also introduced which was rebased on the 3B20= D > > processor and utilized the same 3B cross-compilation SGS under UNIX as = other 3B- > > targeted applications[4]. Interestingly, the paper on software developm= ent > > in [4](p. 109) still makes reference to Programmer's Workbench as of 19= 82, > > implying that nomenclature may have still been the norm at some Bell La= bs sites > > such as Naperville, Illinois, although I can't tell if they're referrin= g to > > PWB as in the branch of UNIX or the environment of make, sccs, etc. > >=20 > > Additionally, is anyone aware of surviving accessible specimens of SWAP > > assembly, EPL, or EPLX code or literature beyond the BSTJ references an= d paper > > referenced in the IEEE library below? Thanks for any insights! > >=20 > > - Matt G. > >=20 > > [1] - https://bitsavers.org/magazines/Bell_System_Technical_Journal/BST= J_V58N06_197907_Part_1.pdf > > [2] - https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/810323 > > [3] - https://bitsavers.org/magazines/Bell_System_Technical_Journal/BST= J_V60N06_198107_Part_2.pdf > > [4] - https://bitsavers.org/magazines/Bell_System_Technical_Journal/BST= J_V62N03_198303_Part_3.pdf Wow, FlashPort sounds like quite the endeavor! It's funny, I've been consi= dering something along those lines for attempting to port older console vid= eo games to computer, somewhere between emulation and a true port, essentia= lly emulation where most of the actual translation of CPU operations has be= en done before-hand (AOT) rather than the common interpreter or dynacomp ap= proaches (JIT). Glad to see a sizeable example of that sort of thing being= used. Now if only Nokia would take a walk through the archives and see if any of = this stuff still exists... - Matt G.