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* [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
@ 2022-05-04  2:08 Warren Toomey via TUHS
  2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
  2022-05-04 17:54 ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Warren Toomey via TUHS @ 2022-05-04  2:08 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

Hi all, I've just changed the DNS CNAME record of www.tuhs.org from
minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) to newmin.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146).

Minnie is running Ubuntu 18.04LTS and is getting a bit long in the
tooth. Newmin is running 22.04LTS. So far I've got the web service
up and running on newmin. Doing the e-mail migration will be fun :-)

Let me know if you spot anything wrong with the new web server. I've
also set up oldwww.tuhs.org which points at minnie, so you can still
get to things on the old server.

Cheers, Warren

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-04  2:08 [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed Warren Toomey via TUHS
@ 2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
  2022-05-04 19:37   ` Mary Ann Horton
  2022-05-05  0:52   ` Dave Horsfall
  2022-05-04 17:54 ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  1 sibling, 2 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Clem Cole @ 2022-05-04 13:27 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Warren Toomey; +Cc: tuhs

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Thank you, Warren for making the tremendous resource available to us all.

Clem
ᐧ

On Tue, May 3, 2022 at 10:11 PM Warren Toomey via TUHS <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org>
wrote:

> Hi all, I've just changed the DNS CNAME record of www.tuhs.org from
> minnie.tuhs.org (45.79.103.53) to newmin.tuhs.org (50.116.15.146).
>
> Minnie is running Ubuntu 18.04LTS and is getting a bit long in the
> tooth. Newmin is running 22.04LTS. So far I've got the web service
> up and running on newmin. Doing the e-mail migration will be fun :-)
>
> Let me know if you spot anything wrong with the new web server. I've
> also set up oldwww.tuhs.org which points at minnie, so you can still
> get to things on the old server.
>
> Cheers, Warren
>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-04  2:08 [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed Warren Toomey via TUHS
  2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
@ 2022-05-04 17:54 ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Grant Taylor via TUHS @ 2022-05-04 17:54 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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On 5/3/22 8:08 PM, Warren Toomey via TUHS wrote:
> Doing the e-mail migration will be fun :-)

I'm curious what your thoughts / plans are on migrating email.

I /think/ that TUHS (and presumably COFF) is using Mailman 2.x which I 
believe is dependent on Python 2.x.  Are you going to be migrating to 
Mailman 3.x / Python 3.x?  Or are you going to go a different direction?



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die


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* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
@ 2022-05-04 19:37   ` Mary Ann Horton
  2022-05-05  0:52   ` Dave Horsfall
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Mary Ann Horton @ 2022-05-04 19:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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Amen. A migration is a lot of work. Thank you for all you do!

     Mary Ann

On 5/4/22 06:27, Clem Cole wrote:
> Thank you, Warren for making the tremendous resource available to us all.
>
> Clem
> ᐧ
>
> On Tue, May 3, 2022 at 10:11 PM Warren Toomey via TUHS 
> <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> wrote:
>
>     Hi all, I've just changed the DNS CNAME record of www.tuhs.org
>     <http://www.tuhs.org> from
>     minnie.tuhs.org <http://minnie.tuhs.org> (45.79.103.53) to
>     newmin.tuhs.org <http://newmin.tuhs.org> (50.116.15.146).
>
>     Minnie is running Ubuntu 18.04LTS and is getting a bit long in the
>     tooth. Newmin is running 22.04LTS. So far I've got the web service
>     up and running on newmin. Doing the e-mail migration will be fun :-)
>
>     Let me know if you spot anything wrong with the new web server. I've
>     also set up oldwww.tuhs.org <http://oldwww.tuhs.org> which points
>     at minnie, so you can still
>     get to things on the old server.
>
>     Cheers, Warren
>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
  2022-05-04 19:37   ` Mary Ann Horton
@ 2022-05-05  0:52   ` Dave Horsfall
  2022-05-05  5:43     ` Andy Kosela
  1 sibling, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Dave Horsfall @ 2022-05-05  0:52 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society

On Wed, 4 May 2022, Clem Cole wrote:

> Thank you, Warren for making the tremendous resource available to us 
> all.

And so say all of us!

-- Dave

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05  0:52   ` Dave Horsfall
@ 2022-05-05  5:43     ` Andy Kosela
  2022-05-05  5:57       ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-05 20:48       ` Dave Horsfall
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Andy Kosela @ 2022-05-05  5:43 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Dave Horsfall; +Cc: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society

On 5/5/22, Dave Horsfall <dave@horsfall.org> wrote:
> On Wed, 4 May 2022, Clem Cole wrote:
>
>> Thank you, Warren for making the tremendous resource available to us
>> all.
>
> And so say all of us!
>

And thank you for keeping the website plain and simple with pure HTML
so it is readable even with text browsers.  These modern trends in web
design are horrible.  We are in a situation you need to buy a new
computer every few years just to read the web!  Binary and encryption
protocols and standards, js crap that change in an increasing pace.
The public information should be accessible by all, even with an old
486dx.

--Andy

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05  5:43     ` Andy Kosela
@ 2022-05-05  5:57       ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-05 20:48       ` Dave Horsfall
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Grant Taylor via TUHS @ 2022-05-05  5:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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On 5/4/22 11:43 PM, Andy Kosela wrote:
> Binary and encryption protocols and standards, js crap that change 
> in an increasing pace.  The public information should be accessible 
> by all, even with an old 486dx.

I believe there is a time and a place for some encryption.  It's 
probably more than you think, but definitely less than zealots want.

Yes, even the venerable 486 should be able to handle the level of 
encryption that I'm referencing.  --  At least it could do the math if 
the software would run on it.

My main reasons for encryption are privacy and generating more noise for 
others to hide their signal in that /need/ to do so.

Privacy also includes some security in that middle boxes can't inject 
questionable (read: malicious) content.



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die


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* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05  5:43     ` Andy Kosela
  2022-05-05  5:57       ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
@ 2022-05-05 20:48       ` Dave Horsfall
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Dave Horsfall @ 2022-05-05 20:48 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: The Eunuchs Hysterical Society

On Thu, 5 May 2022, Andy Kosela wrote:

> And thank you for keeping the website plain and simple with pure HTML so 
> it is readable even with text browsers.  These modern trends in web 
> design are horrible.  We are in a situation you need to buy a new 
> computer every few years just to read the web!  Binary and encryption 
> protocols and standards, js crap that change in an increasing pace. The 
> public information should be accessible by all, even with an old 486dx.

My pet peeve too; if the message cannot be spread without CPU-consuming 
fancy graphics then the message is wrong (and I like to use Lynx).

-- Dave

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-04 17:54 ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
@ 2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
  2022-05-05 23:42     ` Gregg Levine
                       ` (2 more replies)
  0 siblings, 3 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Warren Toomey via TUHS @ 2022-05-05 21:26 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

On Wed, May 04, 2022 at 11:54:25AM -0600, Grant Taylor via TUHS wrote:
> I'm curious what your thoughts / plans are on migrating email.
> I /think/ that TUHS (and presumably COFF) is using Mailman 2.x which I
> believe is dependent on Python 2.x.  Are you going to be migrating to
> Mailman 3.x / Python 3.x?  Or are you going to go a different direction?

Firstly, thanks to you all for your thanks! I announced minnie as an ftp
site on comp.archives back in May 1991, so she must be one of the longest
continually operating Internet sites.

Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import the raw
TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately, will break the hyperlinks
in the current mail archive at https://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/

Anyway, first I've got to get SPF, DKIM and friends set up :-)

Cheers, Warren

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
@ 2022-05-05 23:42     ` Gregg Levine
  2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-09 18:37     ` Danil Smirnov
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Gregg Levine @ 2022-05-05 23:42 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Warren Toomey; +Cc: tuhs

Hello!
And a definite thank you from this end of things as well Warren. Next
question, what about the FTP site?
-----
Gregg C Levine gregg.drwho8@gmail.com
"This signature fought the Time Wars, time and again."

On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 5:31 PM Warren Toomey via TUHS
<tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> wrote:
>
> On Wed, May 04, 2022 at 11:54:25AM -0600, Grant Taylor via TUHS wrote:
> > I'm curious what your thoughts / plans are on migrating email.
> > I /think/ that TUHS (and presumably COFF) is using Mailman 2.x which I
> > believe is dependent on Python 2.x.  Are you going to be migrating to
> > Mailman 3.x / Python 3.x?  Or are you going to go a different direction?
>
> Firstly, thanks to you all for your thanks! I announced minnie as an ftp
> site on comp.archives back in May 1991, so she must be one of the longest
> continually operating Internet sites.
>
> Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import the raw
> TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately, will break the hyperlinks
> in the current mail archive at https://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/
>
> Anyway, first I've got to get SPF, DKIM and friends set up :-)
>
> Cheers, Warren

^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
  2022-05-05 23:42     ` Gregg Levine
@ 2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-06  2:52       ` Warner Losh
                         ` (2 more replies)
  2022-05-09 18:37     ` Danil Smirnov
  2 siblings, 3 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Grant Taylor via TUHS @ 2022-05-06  2:38 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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On 5/5/22 3:26 PM, Warren Toomey via TUHS wrote:
> Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import 
> the raw TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately, 
> will break the hyperlinks in the current mail archive 
> athttps://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/

Let's chat about this when the time comes.

I strongly suspect there is a way to retain functionality for the old 
links, even if they are simply redirects to the new location.  -- I have 
some ideas.  }:-)



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die


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* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
@ 2022-05-06  2:52       ` Warner Losh
  2022-05-06  4:32       ` Kenneth Goodwin
  2022-05-07 16:13       ` Patrick Audley via TUHS
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Warner Losh @ 2022-05-06  2:52 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Grant Taylor; +Cc: TUHS main list

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On Thu, May 5, 2022 at 8:41 PM Grant Taylor via TUHS <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org>
wrote:

> On 5/5/22 3:26 PM, Warren Toomey via TUHS wrote:
> > Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import
> > the raw TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately,
> > will break the hyperlinks in the current mail archive
> > athttps://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/
>
> Let's chat about this when the time comes.
>
> I strongly suspect there is a way to retain functionality for the old
> links, even if they are simply redirects to the new location.  -- I have
> some ideas.  }:-)
>

FreeBSD's archives were updated recently to not use mailman 3
despite the project using mailman 2 due to the link changing issue.

Warner

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-06  2:52       ` Warner Losh
@ 2022-05-06  4:32       ` Kenneth Goodwin
  2022-05-07 16:13       ` Patrick Audley via TUHS
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Kenneth Goodwin @ 2022-05-06  4:32 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Grant Taylor; +Cc: TUHS main list

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Pardon my ignorance as I am not familiar with mailman and its storage
format but I assume that running the mailbox through a Sed filter to change
Minnie to newmin would not work???  Minnie and newmin are the same length.
Any size data would therefore presumably remain valid. This assumes the
mail archive is text based for the most part.

Just thinking out loud....

On Thu, May 5, 2022, 10:41 PM Grant Taylor via TUHS <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org>
wrote:

> On 5/5/22 3:26 PM, Warren Toomey via TUHS wrote:
> > Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import
> > the raw TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately,
> > will break the hyperlinks in the current mail archive
> > athttps://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/
>
> Let's chat about this when the time comes.
>
> I strongly suspect there is a way to retain functionality for the old
> links, even if they are simply redirects to the new location.  -- I have
> some ideas.  }:-)
>
>
>
> --
> Grant. . . .
> unix || die
>
>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-06  2:52       ` Warner Losh
  2022-05-06  4:32       ` Kenneth Goodwin
@ 2022-05-07 16:13       ` Patrick Audley via TUHS
  2022-05-09 16:12         ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Patrick Audley via TUHS @ 2022-05-07 16:13 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Grant Taylor; +Cc: tuhs

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On Thu., May 5, 2022, 7:38 p.m. Grant Taylor via TUHS,
<tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org> wrote:
>
> On 5/5/22 3:26 PM, Warren Toomey via TUHS wrote:
> > Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import
> > the raw TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately,
> > will break the hyperlinks in the current mail archive
> > athttps://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/
>
> Let's chat about this when the time comes.
>
> I strongly suspect there is a way to retain functionality for the old
> links, even if they are simply redirects to the new location.  -- I have
> some ideas.  }:-)

When I saw this, I started to think, "I bet we can make a regexp for that".
Apparently, I do too much text processing.  I'm up for helping process the
archive if needed with sed, perl or some such.

--
"...one of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that,
  lacking zero, they had no way to indicate successful termination of
  their C programs." -- Robert Firth

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* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-07 16:13       ` Patrick Audley via TUHS
@ 2022-05-09 16:12         ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  2022-05-09 17:55           ` Kenneth Goodwin
  0 siblings, 1 reply; 19+ messages in thread
From: Grant Taylor via TUHS @ 2022-05-09 16:12 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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On 5/7/22 10:13 AM, Patrick Audley via TUHS wrote:
> When I saw this, I started to think, "I bet we can make a regexp for that".

:-D

> Apparently, I do too much text processing.

Na.  I don't think so.  Text processing seems to be one (of the many) 
thing(s) that Unix, et al., excel at.  So I think it's probably natural 
for anyone well versed in Unix ... to think "RegEx"!

> I'm up for helping process the archive if needed with sed, perl or 
> some such.

I think we're thinking about two different layers of actions.  Both 
using their own form of RegEx like behavior.

It sounds like you're talking about processing / munging an mbox mail 
archive.

I'm thinking about URL re-writing in the web server, be it on the fly or 
static configuration (for fixed list of old URLs).



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-09 16:12         ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
@ 2022-05-09 17:55           ` Kenneth Goodwin
  2022-05-09 19:22             ` Richard Salz
  2022-05-09 19:57             ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  0 siblings, 2 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Kenneth Goodwin @ 2022-05-09 17:55 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Grant Taylor; +Cc: TUHS main list

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Url rewriting

That would mean supporting that forever including the overhead in contrast
to the "SED modify the archive" approach is a one shot or so deal.



On Mon, May 9, 2022, 12:15 PM Grant Taylor via TUHS <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org>
wrote:

> On 5/7/22 10:13 AM, Patrick Audley via TUHS wrote:
> > When I saw this, I started to think, "I bet we can make a regexp for
> that".
>
> :-D
>
> > Apparently, I do too much text processing.
>
> Na.  I don't think so.  Text processing seems to be one (of the many)
> thing(s) that Unix, et al., excel at.  So I think it's probably natural
> for anyone well versed in Unix ... to think "RegEx"!
>
> > I'm up for helping process the archive if needed with sed, perl or
> > some such.
>
> I think we're thinking about two different layers of actions.  Both
> using their own form of RegEx like behavior.
>
> It sounds like you're talking about processing / munging an mbox mail
> archive.
>
> I'm thinking about URL re-writing in the web server, be it on the fly or
> static configuration (for fixed list of old URLs).
>
>
>
> --
> Grant. . . .
> unix || die
>
>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
  2022-05-05 23:42     ` Gregg Levine
  2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
@ 2022-05-09 18:37     ` Danil Smirnov
  2 siblings, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Danil Smirnov @ 2022-05-09 18:37 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Warren Toomey; +Cc: tuhs

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Hi Warren,

пт, 6 мая 2022 г., 00:31 Warren Toomey via TUHS <tuhs@minnie.tuhs.org>:

> Yes, I plan on moving to Mailman 3.x. I'm hoping that I can import the raw
> TUHS mbox (currently 130Mbytes). This, unfortunately, will break the
> hyperlinks
> in the current mail archive at https://minnie.tuhs.org/pipermail/tuhs/
>

I can provide you with advice on migration based on my vast experience.
Feel free to ask!

Sincerely,
Danil Smirnov
Mailman3.com

>

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-09 17:55           ` Kenneth Goodwin
@ 2022-05-09 19:22             ` Richard Salz
  2022-05-09 19:57             ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Richard Salz @ 2022-05-09 19:22 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: Kenneth Goodwin; +Cc: TUHS main list, Grant Taylor

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It depends on what status you send; 301 is "moved permanently" and search
engines will get the hint; 302 is a temporary condition.

A quick look shows it's running Apache; mod_rewrite can handle things.
(And hey, on Linode, my $DAYJOB's latest acquisition :)

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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

* Re: [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed
  2022-05-09 17:55           ` Kenneth Goodwin
  2022-05-09 19:22             ` Richard Salz
@ 2022-05-09 19:57             ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
  1 sibling, 0 replies; 19+ messages in thread
From: Grant Taylor via TUHS @ 2022-05-09 19:57 UTC (permalink / raw)
  To: tuhs

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On 5/9/22 11:55 AM, Kenneth Goodwin wrote:
> Url rewriting

Yes.

> That would mean supporting that forever including the overhead in 
> contrast to the "SED modify the archive" approach is a one shot or so deal.

I'm concerned with supporting the URLs that are in all of the emails 
that have been sent out over the years that point back to the archive.

sed won't change what's in someone else's email box.  URL rewriting will 
make sure that was was sent out in the past will continue to work in the 
future.  ;-)



-- 
Grant. . . .
unix || die


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^ permalink raw reply	[flat|nested] 19+ messages in thread

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Thread overview: 19+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed)
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2022-05-04  2:08 [TUHS] TUHS web server has changed Warren Toomey via TUHS
2022-05-04 13:27 ` Clem Cole
2022-05-04 19:37   ` Mary Ann Horton
2022-05-05  0:52   ` Dave Horsfall
2022-05-05  5:43     ` Andy Kosela
2022-05-05  5:57       ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
2022-05-05 20:48       ` Dave Horsfall
2022-05-04 17:54 ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
2022-05-05 21:26   ` Warren Toomey via TUHS
2022-05-05 23:42     ` Gregg Levine
2022-05-06  2:38     ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
2022-05-06  2:52       ` Warner Losh
2022-05-06  4:32       ` Kenneth Goodwin
2022-05-07 16:13       ` Patrick Audley via TUHS
2022-05-09 16:12         ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
2022-05-09 17:55           ` Kenneth Goodwin
2022-05-09 19:22             ` Richard Salz
2022-05-09 19:57             ` Grant Taylor via TUHS
2022-05-09 18:37     ` Danil Smirnov

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