setopt returns both "interactive and login"

setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Timothy Stone]

Can my shell be both 'interactive' and 'login' at the same time?

% set | grep -i version
...
ZSH_VERSION=4.2.3
...

% uname -a
Darwin colossus 8.6.0 Darwin Kernel Version 8.6.0: Tue Mar  7  
16:58:48 PST 2006; root:xnu-792.6.70.obj~1/RELEASE_PPC Power  
Macintosh powerpc

... otherwise known as Mac OS X Tiger (10.4.6)

[tstone@colossus]~% setopt
autocd
extendedglob
interactive
login
monitor
shinstdin
zle

So... can my shell be both interactive and login. I'm not seeing  
anything in my /etc startup files that might be doing this. Maybe  
this is something unique to Mac OS X/Darwin builds, or invocations  
with the Terminal.app.

Thanks,
Tim

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Peter Stephenson]

Timothy Stone wrote:
> Can my shell be both 'interactive' and 'login' at the same time?

Yes, that's the normal case for a login shell.

-- 
Peter Stephenson <pws@csr.com>                  Software Engineer
CSR PLC, Churchill House, Cambridge Business Park, Cowley Road
Cambridge, CB4 0WZ, UK                          Tel: +44 (0)1223 692070


To access the latest news from CSR copy this link into a web browser:  http://www.csr.com/email_sig.php

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Timothy Stone]

On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:34 PM, Peter Stephenson wrote:

> Timothy Stone wrote:
>> Can my shell be both 'interactive' and 'login' at the same time?
>
> Yes, that's the normal case for a login shell.

Hmmm... I'm beginning to understand something is occurring behind the  
scenes here... the *NIX /login/ utility.

So, when I open a new terminal window, with /insert favorite terminal  
application here/, the /login/ utility is invoked and I get a *login*  
shell, this is *interactive*. Following that, I request a new shell  
at the command line, barring the /-l/ switch, I get a new, but / 
interactive/ shell:

% ssh luser@box
Password:
[luser@box] ~% setopt
...
interactive
login
...
[luser@box] ~% zsh
[luser@box] ~% setopt
...
interactive
...

Am I on the right path here?

Thanks,
Tim

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Michael Hernandez]

On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:56 PM, Timothy Stone wrote:

>
> On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:34 PM, Peter Stephenson wrote:
>
>> Timothy Stone wrote:
>>> Can my shell be both 'interactive' and 'login' at the same time?
>>
>> Yes, that's the normal case for a login shell.
>
> Hmmm... I'm beginning to understand something is occurring behind  
> the scenes here... the *NIX /login/ utility.
>
> So, when I open a new terminal window, with /insert favorite  
> terminal application here/, the /login/ utility is invoked and I  
> get a *login* shell, this is *interactive*. Following that, I  
> request a new shell at the command line, barring the /-l/ switch, I  
> get a new, but /interactive/ shell:
> Am I on the right path here?

If you are talking about a terminal window in X, you will (usually,  
YMMV) get an interactive shell always (because it's a shell waiting  
for your input at the terminal), but in order to have your terminal  
window use a login shell you need to specify that as such. For  
example Gnome-terminal or Konsole have check boxes in their settings  
you can tick to say you want the shell to be a login, or in xterm  
(also mrxvt, and some others) you can add -ls to the xterm command  
line to tell it you want a login shell.

The difference between login and interactive shells is not as  
noticeable in zsh because of the way zsh handles startup files. Bash,  
for example, will only source .profile for login shells and .bashrc  
for all interactive shells (and both for shells that are both login  
and interactive), but zsh has a very complex (yet very convenient,  
depending on how you look at it) way of handling the startup files  
which can make the distinction between login and interactive shells  
blurry.

One rule that you can keep in mind is that all login shells are going  
to be interactive but not all interactive shells are login shells  
(and again, the difference is not so important for zsh afaict).

The "user friendly user guide" and the book "From Bash to Z Shell"  
both cover this, and are both very helpful (the Bash to Z Shell book  
especially, if you want to see comparisons between shells).

Hope this helps!

Mike

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Peter Stephenson]

Timothy Stone wrote:
> So, when I open a new terminal window, with /insert favorite terminal  
> application here/, the /login/ utility is invoked and I get a *login*  
> shell, this is *interactive*. Following that, I request a new shell  
> at the command line, barring the /-l/ switch, I get a new, but / 
> interactive/ shell:
> 
> % ssh luser@box
> Password:
> [luser@box] ~% setopt
> ...
> interactive
> login
> ...
> [luser@box] ~% zsh
> [luser@box] ~% setopt
> ...
> interactive
> ...
> 
> Am I on the right path here?

Yes, this too is standard behaviour.  (Plug:  It's described explicitly
in "From Bash to Z Shell", chapter 5.)

-- 
Peter Stephenson <pws@csr.com>                  Software Engineer
CSR PLC, Churchill House, Cambridge Business Park, Cowley Road
Cambridge, CB4 0WZ, UK                          Tel: +44 (0)1223 692070


To access the latest news from CSR copy this link into a web browser:  http://www.csr.com/email_sig.php

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Danek Duvall]

On Mon, Jun 26, 2006 at 02:14:12PM -0400, Michael Hernandez wrote:

> One rule that you can keep in mind is that all login shells are going to be 
> interactive but not all interactive shells are login shells (and again, the 
> difference is not so important for zsh afaict).

Not *entirely* true, but generally so: "ssh -T <host>" will give you a
login shell that isn't interactive.  I don't think many people actually do
crazy stuff like that, though.  :)

Danek

Re: setopt returns both "interactive and login"

[Timothy Stone]

On Jun 26, 2006, at 2:14 PM, Michael Hernandez wrote:

> On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:56 PM, Timothy Stone wrote:
>
>>
>> On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:34 PM, Peter Stephenson wrote:
>>
>>> Timothy Stone wrote:
>>>> Can my shell be both 'interactive' and 'login' at the same time?
>>>
>>> Yes, that's the normal case for a login shell.
>>
>> Hmmm... I'm beginning to understand something is occurring behind  
>> the scenes here... the *NIX /login/ utility.
>>
>> So, when I open a new terminal window, with /insert favorite  
>> terminal application here/, the /login/ utility is invoked and I  
>> get a *login* shell, this is *interactive*. Following that, I  
>> request a new shell at the command line, barring the /-l/ switch,  
>> I get a new, but /interactive/ shell:
>> Am I on the right path here?
>
>
> The "user friendly user guide" and the book "From Bash to Z Shell"  
> both cover this, and are both very helpful (the Bash to Z Shell  
> book especially, if you want to see comparisons between shells).

I have the latter, so I may have missed something in the text. I'll  
take a peek at the /User Friendly User Guide/ as a supplement.

Peter, just saw your reply. Thanks. (No need to plug the book.  
Excellent material!) I'm just trying all of this out in a real world  
environment and syncing my mental expectations with the actual  
practice of it.

Many thanks!
Tim

>
> Hope this helps!
>
> Mike