From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 11902 invoked by alias); 9 Sep 2012 17:51:23 -0000 Mailing-List: contact zsh-users-help@zsh.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Id: Zsh Users List List-Post: List-Help: X-Seq: 17241 Received: (qmail 10093 invoked from network); 9 Sep 2012 17:51:10 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on f.primenet.com.au X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.3.2 Received-SPF: none (ns1.primenet.com.au: domain at sym2.noone.org does not designate permitted sender hosts) Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2012 19:51:04 +0200 From: Axel Beckert To: zsh-users@zsh.org Subject: Re: Zsh on Debian is beginning to rot Message-ID: <20120909175104.GV30122@sym.noone.org> Mail-Followup-To: zsh-users@zsh.org References: <20120909131050.15057aa6@internecto.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20120909131050.15057aa6@internecto.net> X-Operating-System: Linux 2.6.32-5-xen-amd64 X-Machine: sym2 x86_64 X-Editor: GNU Emacs 23.2.1 Face: 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 Organization: DeuxChevaux.org -- The =?iso-8859-1?Q?Citr?= =?iso-8859-1?B?b+tu?= 2CV Database User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) Hi, On Sun, Sep 09, 2012 at 01:10:50PM +0200, Mark van Dijk wrote: > Subject: Zsh on Debian is beginning to rot Ehm, do you really know what you're talking about? > Take a look at this output of my Debian Squeeze box: > > Package: zsh > Version: 4.3.10-14 Squeeze is about 1.5 years old, Squeeze's feature freeze was in the beginning of August 2010 and zsh 4.3.10 was the uptodate zsh developement (!) release back then. Do you really know how Linux distributions in general and Debian in specific works? I don't think so. > Package: zsh-beta > Version: 4.3.10-dev-1+20100720-1 Compare the freeze date with the date in the version number: Clint upload an uptodate snapshot just two weeks before the freeze for Squeeze. > Debian sid is not much better - version 4.3.17. Which is the second last release of zsh and the last developement release of zsh before the freeze for Wheezy. Nothing wrong here either. As Frank already pointed out, there is an uptodate 5.0.0 package (actually in its second incarnation) in Debian Experimental. It's in Experimental and not Sid because of the freeze for Wheezy. Please read http://www.debian.org/devel/testing if you don't understand why it works that way and not differently. > I wonder why it's been so long since Zsh has had a decent upgrade on > Debian. Because it will never happen after a stable release has happened and it usually doesn't happen after a feature freeze either. That's why it's called "feature freeze" and "stable". No more changes which could break something. Stable APIs and ABIs. That's what users can rely on. > Is there no package maintainer? There is actually a team of four maintainers plus several very active and helpful regular bug reports -- which btw. all read this mailing list, too. All in all a very healthy maintainer infrastructure of which many packages can only dream of. > Is there a semi or non-official Zsh repository for Debian? We see no need for that. You can use the Debian Experimental repository if you want to stay on bleeding edge stuff during the freeze for the next Debian stable release. There is though the Jenkins repository[1] of the Debian Zsh Packaging Team which automatically builds packages after each push from a team member. Those packages are really bleeding edge, but be aware that those packages may be broken, too. Use at your risk and don't whine if it breaks your box. (Bug reports welcome, though. ;-) > Of course (imho) the most convenient solution would be if debian > just would replace all the zsh packages in stable, testing and > unstable with a single zsh package. Version 5. Ok, this shows that you really have _NO_ idea how Debian or most other Linux distributions work. Go and do your homework before complaining. See the according question[2] in FAQ for a start. (Or use a rolling release based Linux distribution instead in case you dislike the idea of _stable_ _releases_.) > Hopefully someone's reading this who is able to pull some strings... Yeah, the strings we pulled are those in our e-mail client so that two e-mails to the zsh users mailing list were written. Footnotes: [1] http://jenkins.grml.org/job/zsh-source/ [2] http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-faq/ch-getting.en.html#s-updatestable Kind regards, Axel -- /~\ Plain Text Ribbon Campaign | Axel Beckert \ / Say No to HTML in E-Mail and News | abe@deuxchevaux.org (Mail) X See http://www.asciiribbon.org/ | abe@noone.org (Mail+Jabber) / \ I love long mails: http://email.is-not-s.ms/ | http://noone.org/abe/ (Web)