* Real KSH93 is finally free software! @ 2005-04-12 5:12 Juhapekka Tolvanen 2005-04-12 5:34 ` Bart Schaefer 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Juhapekka Tolvanen @ 2005-04-12 5:12 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list http://www.kornshell.com/ http://www.research.att.com/sw/download They switched to Common Public License Version 1.0. Now I just wonder: What features and abilities of KSH93 are still missing from zsh? Is it possible to find useful KSH93-script that runs fine under real KSH93 but not very well under zsh? P.S: BTW also graphviz is free same way. -- Juhapekka "naula" Tolvanen * http colon slash slash iki dot fi slash juhtolv "Lennän taas. Olen juppihippipunkkari ja vaihdan paikkaa. Lennän taas. Turha meikäläistä yrittääkään kategoriin laittaa. Hei mä lennän taas. Olen juppihippipunkkari ja vaihdan paikkaa. Lennän taas." Neljä Ruusua ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 5:12 Real KSH93 is finally free software! Juhapekka Tolvanen @ 2005-04-12 5:34 ` Bart Schaefer 2005-04-12 12:11 ` Juhapekka Tolvanen 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Bart Schaefer @ 2005-04-12 5:34 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list On Apr 12, 8:12am, Juhapekka Tolvanen wrote: } } Now I just wonder: What features and abilities of KSH93 are still } missing from zsh? Is it possible to find useful KSH93-script that runs } fine under real KSH93 but not very well under zsh? Sure; almost anything using namerefs or discipline functions. Obviously, it's also possible to find useful zsh scripts that won't run under ksh93. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 5:34 ` Bart Schaefer @ 2005-04-12 12:11 ` Juhapekka Tolvanen [not found] ` <juhtolv@cc.jyu.fi> 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Juhapekka Tolvanen @ 2005-04-12 12:11 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list Bart Schaefer <schaefer@brasslantern.com> writes: > On Apr 12, 8:12am, Juhapekka Tolvanen wrote: > } > } Now I just wonder: What features and abilities of KSH93 are still > } missing from zsh? Is it possible to find useful KSH93-script that runs > } fine under real KSH93 but not very well under zsh? > Sure; almost anything using namerefs or discipline functions. Are them difficult or impossible to implement? If not, when they are added to zsh? -- Juhapekka "naula" Tolvanen * http colon slash slash iki dot fi slash juhtolv "Lennän taas. Olen juppihippipunkkari ja vaihdan paikkaa. Lennän taas. Turha meikäläistä yrittääkään kategoriin laittaa. Hei mä lennän taas. Olen juppihippipunkkari ja vaihdan paikkaa. Lennän taas." Neljä Ruusua ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
[parent not found: <juhtolv@cc.jyu.fi>]
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! [not found] ` <juhtolv@cc.jyu.fi> @ 2005-04-12 12:38 ` Peter Stephenson 2005-04-12 13:22 ` Nikolai Weibull 2005-04-12 15:17 ` Bart Schaefer 0 siblings, 2 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Peter Stephenson @ 2005-04-12 12:38 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list, pws Juhapekka Tolvanen wrote: > Bart Schaefer <schaefer@brasslantern.com> writes: > > > On Apr 12, 8:12am, Juhapekka Tolvanen wrote: > > } > > } Now I just wonder: What features and abilities of KSH93 are still > > } missing from zsh? Is it possible to find useful KSH93-script that runs > > } fine under real KSH93 but not very well under zsh? > > > Sure; almost anything using namerefs or discipline functions. > > Are them difficult or impossible to implement? If not, when they are > added to zsh? I don't think they're particularly tricky, but they won't ever be added unless someone specifically volunteers to write them. pws ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. ********************************************************************** ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 12:38 ` Peter Stephenson @ 2005-04-12 13:22 ` Nikolai Weibull 2005-04-12 15:17 ` Bart Schaefer 1 sibling, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Nikolai Weibull @ 2005-04-12 13:22 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list Peter Stephenson, April 12: > > [namerefs] > I don't think they're particularly tricky, but they won't ever be added > unless someone specifically volunteers to write them. I'd love namerefs. I'll give it a try once I have time, say at the end of the summer. Until then, nikolai -- Nikolai Weibull: now available free of charge at http://bitwi.se/! Born in Chicago, IL USA; currently residing in Gothenburg, Sweden. main(){printf(&linux["\021%six\012\0"],(linux)["have"]+"fun"-97);} ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 12:38 ` Peter Stephenson 2005-04-12 13:22 ` Nikolai Weibull @ 2005-04-12 15:17 ` Bart Schaefer 2005-04-12 16:20 ` Oliver Kiddle 1 sibling, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Bart Schaefer @ 2005-04-12 15:17 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list On Apr 12, 1:38pm, Peter Stephenson wrote: } } Juhapekka Tolvanen wrote: } > Bart Schaefer <schaefer@brasslantern.com> writes: } > } > > Sure; almost anything using namerefs or discipline functions. } > } > Are them difficult or impossible to implement? If not, when they are } > added to zsh? } } I don't think they're particularly tricky Actually they *are* particularly tricky, because of the way zsh's nested parameter expansion passes data around. Our first attempt to implement namerefs was what led to ${(P)var}. Discipline functions are ugly because in order to set them the parser has to implement the other missing bit of ksh syntax, which is namespaces as in ${foo.bar}. Zsh doesn't allow "." as a valid character in variable names and it's difficult to do so because the same identifier parser is used both inside and outside the braces; that is, if you make the most obvious change to enable ${foo.bar} then $foo.bar also parses as a single variable name rather than as ${foo}.bar, which will break large numbers of scripts. So the changes to implement both of these things go fairly deep into the most critical parts of the shell. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 15:17 ` Bart Schaefer @ 2005-04-12 16:20 ` Oliver Kiddle 2005-04-12 17:01 ` Bart Schaefer 0 siblings, 1 reply; 8+ messages in thread From: Oliver Kiddle @ 2005-04-12 16:20 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list Bart wrote: > > Actually they *are* particularly tricky, because of the way zsh's nested > parameter expansion passes data around. Our first attempt to implement > namerefs was what led to ${(P)var}. For namerefs, the main job is cleaning up typeset code to not keep disposing of parameters and recreating them anew. The typeset code is also cluttered with special cases for handling special variables. So some form of primitive typeset function needs to go in the _gsu struct. > Discipline functions are ugly because in order to set them the parser has > to implement the other missing bit of ksh syntax, which is namespaces as > in ${foo.bar}. Zsh doesn't allow "." as a valid character in variable The ksh93 implementation of discipline functions doesn't cope well with the fact that functions don't follow parameter scoping rules. So any implementation of discipline functions may be better off using a different design, incompatible with ksh. Compound variables, namespaces and static scoping are higher on my wishlist anyway. Oliver ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
* Re: Real KSH93 is finally free software! 2005-04-12 16:20 ` Oliver Kiddle @ 2005-04-12 17:01 ` Bart Schaefer 0 siblings, 0 replies; 8+ messages in thread From: Bart Schaefer @ 2005-04-12 17:01 UTC (permalink / raw) To: zsh-users mailing list On Apr 12, 6:20pm, Oliver Kiddle wrote: } } The ksh93 implementation of discipline functions doesn't cope well } with the fact that functions don't follow parameter scoping rules. So } any implementation of discipline functions may be better off using a } different design, incompatible with ksh. That doesn't address the original question whether zsh can be capable of executing any and all interesting ksh scripts. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 8+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2005-04-12 17:02 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 8+ messages (download: mbox.gz / follow: Atom feed) -- links below jump to the message on this page -- 2005-04-12 5:12 Real KSH93 is finally free software! Juhapekka Tolvanen 2005-04-12 5:34 ` Bart Schaefer 2005-04-12 12:11 ` Juhapekka Tolvanen [not found] ` <juhtolv@cc.jyu.fi> 2005-04-12 12:38 ` Peter Stephenson 2005-04-12 13:22 ` Nikolai Weibull 2005-04-12 15:17 ` Bart Schaefer 2005-04-12 16:20 ` Oliver Kiddle 2005-04-12 17:01 ` Bart Schaefer
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