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dmarc=pass header.from=ntlworld.com; arc=none Received: from smtpq1.tb.ukmail.iss.as9143.net ([212.54.57.96]:35702) by zero.zsh.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) id 1mrk4K-0003Gw-Ce; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 17:03:57 +0000 Received: from [212.54.57.82] (helo=smtp3.tb.ukmail.iss.as9143.net) by smtpq1.tb.ukmail.iss.as9143.net with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1mrk4K-0002uW-7d for zsh-users@zsh.org; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 18:03:56 +0100 Received: from oxbe8.tb.ukmail.iss.as9143.net ([172.25.160.139]) by smtp3.tb.ukmail.iss.as9143.net with ESMTP id rk4Km7tgFiBAerk4KmXGgZ; Mon, 29 Nov 2021 18:03:56 +0100 X-Env-Mailfrom: p.w.stephenson@ntlworld.com X-Env-Rcptto: zsh-users@zsh.org X-SourceIP: 172.25.160.139 X-CNFS-Analysis: v=2.4 cv=S9LKfagP c=1 sm=1 tr=0 ts=61a507fc cx=a_exe a=pgSR3NrKiwmx/6vnWRL19w==:117 a=I_Av47A-8eYA:10 a=IkcTkHD0fZMA:10 a=vinPr5In5y8A:10 a=HYshxDoSAAAA:8 a=Xf9CsOXtayEMTE9ZVzkA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=na7qQM7zoEAPfvOk0o6d:22 X-Authenticated-Sender: p.w.stephenson@ntlworld.com DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=ntlworld.com; s=meg.feb2017; t=1638205436; bh=rwBoRTUCRx6yEtn9b9hs5PPl9oaPTj0qm7P/107gOVc=; h=Date:From:To:In-Reply-To:References:Subject; b=uFxSsYGX6bJJy7RVVWdFPF1v5W76CXyNnHlP/dpfEbjW1wn67kvILbGXV800XhEHw tdkMC/dmls3PrMkyb6XI+mrxyQODEiGVqcXHlZ2m3RoNwbRD8tXmnbEZuSchWGssKr xc+nHJGc2JXTp60sPStfkbwFMjPQro2zfe39BrV2gmcZYl2l0nMN+NW+rVDFv1cYUd HgsSEifj62DCQxEzeAmBXM2L/r0zOIaqCXH24vEbMwlDeaeKPeiEctqD9z6oCqC9vt Y399iIeUemS6hKqTaWSAoMV0IKM+n7dn0gqPg40huoL0dJTguuBIdkNRQFJFNPR0iC kc6LpS2mrbN2A== Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2021 17:03:56 +0000 (GMT) From: Peter Stephenson To: zsh-users@zsh.org Message-ID: <391893577.569127.1638205436152@mail2.virginmedia.com> In-Reply-To: <1be1289c-c3a1-4730-baab-5625af464cb1@www.fastmail.com> References: <1be1289c-c3a1-4730-baab-5625af464cb1@www.fastmail.com> Subject: Re: (z) expansion flag do not always return an array MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 Importance: Medium X-Mailer: Open-Xchange Mailer v7.8.4-Rev72 X-Originating-IP: 165.225.17.146 X-Originating-Client: open-xchange-appsuite X-CMAE-Envelope: MS4xfE4Zc9H8Z02Q8WDH1Ofd+pikk2y/kUr2z8qFfH0UnSDlHKTEvuKgCOR+Hnbmn4vTpEXvzWwIJ5yRnmmJMSyu/3d5plP79C1Bd3Ot+Pxs11Hf0w37PML8 xS2JKgvetHJx7+6I+ErjFP36PXPAOeHLvMJ9MHgktPryxqMQ3ZfeLq8/t/R7EgVir/ECDHCwwmhyZ5ypJ7qVDRGudt3kA8CGd4MCItL/bhn3GuQtco5kZM5A X-Seq: 27386 Archived-At: X-Loop: zsh-users@zsh.org Errors-To: zsh-users-owner@zsh.org Precedence: list Precedence: bulk Sender: zsh-users-request@zsh.org X-no-archive: yes List-Id: List-Help: List-Subscribe: List-Unsubscribe: List-Post: List-Owner: List-Archive: > On 29 November 2021 at 16:50 Lawrence Vel=C3=A1zquez wro= te: > On Mon, Nov 29, 2021, at 10:31 AM, Vincent Bernat wrote: > > The (z) expansion flag is documented to return an array >=20 > Is it? The 5.8 man page does not mention "array" even once. Indeed, there's not really any notion of "returning an array". There's just the question of how something is treated at a particular part of parameter expansion. Forcing something to be treated in a particular way by tweaking the expansion is possible, forcing a particular value always to be treated in some way regardless of context isn't, to the best of my knowledge. The context always has the last say --- consider quoting, and the flags to circumvent quoting, for example. They're all (over the top metaphor coming) breadcrumbs to lead us of the labyrinth that's ended up at a corner. More generally, return values and explicit expression typing are things shells, including zsh, are very bad at; it's particularly annoying with zsh, however, owing to the complexities you can get into, and nested parameters are one of the worst examples. Feel free to find a counterexample, obviously. pws