From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: (qmail 15689 invoked by alias); 10 Sep 2012 15:30:05 -0000 Mailing-List: contact zsh-users-help@zsh.org; run by ezmlm Precedence: bulk X-No-Archive: yes List-Id: Zsh Users List List-Post: List-Help: X-Seq: 17253 Received: (qmail 5658 invoked from network); 10 Sep 2012 15:30:02 -0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.2 (2011-06-06) on f.primenet.com.au X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW autolearn=ham version=3.3.2 Received-SPF: pass (ns1.primenet.com.au: SPF record at _spf.eastlink.ca designates 24.224.136.10 as permitted sender) X-CMAE-Score: 0 X-CMAE-Analysis: v=2.0 cv=Qa8dTrnv c=1 sm=1 a=sgO5gNtQRqEA:10 a=p_-359i49kcA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=biLW-yrtH-MA:10 a=ztYyRUKY-y-PF_rklOIA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=E/PVjAe7IbPkHCM0BPV0xg==:117 Message-id: <504E0058.8010802@eastlink.ca> Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2012 07:59:36 -0700 From: Ray Andrews User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:14.0) Gecko/20120713 Thunderbird/14.0 MIME-version: 1.0 To: zsh-users@zsh.org, Axel Beckert Subject: Re: Zsh on Debian is beginning to rot References: <20120909131050.15057aa6@internecto.net> <20120909175104.GV30122@sym.noone.org> <20120909203808.7c627d0c@internecto.net> <20120910001601.GW30122@sym.noone.org> In-reply-to: <20120910001601.GW30122@sym.noone.org> Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit On 09/09/12 05:16 PM, Axel Beckert wrote: > Hi Mark, > > On Sun, Sep 09, 2012 at 08:38:08PM +0200, Mark van Dijk wrote: >>> Squeeze is about 1.5 years old, Squeeze's feature freeze was in the >>> beginning of August 2010 and zsh 4.3.10 was the uptodate zsh >>> developement (!) release back then. >> Yeah, so it's 2 years old and it did have some minor fixes since then. >> The word 'rot' was chosen poorly sorry about that, if I pissed you >> off too much I apologise. > Ah, civility triumphs. > > > > Gentlemen, this brings up a meta question of mine that I can't find the > answer too anywhere. It's off topic, but since we have a genuine Debian > packager at hand, maybe he can answer it, or perhaps point me to some > doc that does explain it. > > > > Why are Debian packages often so far behind?--vs, say, Arch, who often > have packages out the day after they are released from upstream? This > is not a bitchy comment, it is an honest question--I'm sure there is a > very good reason, I'd just like to know what it is. What is involved in > making a package? I'd have thought that when someone releases > something, it would take five minutes to just 'wrap it up' into the > package format and that would be that. When I download something as SRC > and build it, it often seems 'that simple', yet packaging things seems > to be quite a chore and to take years. > > > > Take Xfce. I'd like to try 4.10. Now, I know I can build it from SRC, > but why is it that (at least last time I checked) it is not available in > Testing? Arch had a package of it out, literally a couple of days > after it was released. What is it that Debian packagers do that takes > so long? I get the feeling that somehow software packages need to be > customized and tweaked for a year or two before they can be included. > Why? Slackware makes it a point of pride that they don't customize or > tweak stuff at all, and yet, they too seem to take their time getting > packages together, and they release a monolithic distro like Debian as > if (so it might seem) all the parts have to be carefully checked out and > mated to all the other parts to avoid disaster. OTOH, Arch seems to > feel that you can put things together any way you want and it should all > work like lego. It should all work like lego. > > > > Or take the current thing, Debian/zsh. It sounds like Axel has put his > heart and soul into Debian/zsh, but what on Earth does that involve? > I'd have thought that zsh is zsh is zsh regardless of the distro. If > anyone can help me to get a ground level understanding of this whole > subject I'd be very obliged.